‘Changing the Terms of the Debate’ — The Politico Interview with PM Orbán
Prime Minister Viktor Orbán has “changed the terms of the debate” on migration policy in Europe and is “offering ideas that the rest of the bloc can’t ignore.” That’s according to the Politico interview published in the European edition on Monday.
Interviews with the prime minister in the international press appear only seldomly and this one, conducted by Politico’s Executive Editor Matthew Kaminski, covers a wide range of topics. As such, it offers a rare glimpse in English of the prime minister’s views on issues from migration to the future of Europe and Hungary’s place in it.
The prime minister’s critics will take advantage of some of the quotes — and the headline, in particular — but, for those who appreciate thoughtful, straight talk, there’s a lot to be had in this piece, an intimate conversation with a European leader who, in the author’s own words, “defies facile caricature.” Here are a few excerpts:
Politico on Prime Minister Orbán’s leadership in Europe:
Whether European leaders like Orbán or not, the Hungarian’s critique of the EU’s migration policy this year changed the terms of the debate. With blaring alarms about terrorism across Europe, the leader of this country of 10 million is again the uncensored Id of the European right, offering ideas that the rest of the bloc can’t ignore (and even, in some cases, pronounce aloud).
The prime minister on the massive, unregulated influx of migrants to Europe:
“All of them present a security threat because we don’t know who they are. If you allow thousands or millions of unidentified persons into your house, the risk of … terrorism will significantly increase.”
Politico on the prime minister’s position on the migration crisis and the EU’s response:
But, as calls grow to rethink open borders — with five Western European countries holding preliminary talks about a more limited “mini-Schengen” zone (which wouldn’t include Hungary) — Orbán presents his hard line on frontiers as the best way to silence calls to suspend or bury Schengen.
“We would like to save Schengen,” he says. “We would like to save the liberties … including the free movement inside the European Union,” which, he says, are imperilled by unregulated and porous external borders.
Politico on the prime minister’s views on the future of Europe and Hungary’s place in it:
For the Hungarian, this year of troubles — from Greece to migration, from terrorism to possible Brexit — calls for a wholesale rethink of the EU. The bloc “is only reacting, reacting, crisis after crisis, instead of having a concept.” Asked if the EU will be here in 10 years, he says, “it’s an open question.”
Orbán insists he wants to save the EU and NATO. “Hungary’s place is [in the] West,” he says. “We criticize them because they are far from perfect, but the starting attitude of the Hungarians to Western institutions is always positive.”
Politico on “the dictator”:
He isn’t a “dictator” à la Putin or Recep Tayyip Erdoğan, to use the gibe thrown at him by Jean-Claude Juncker. In his half comic, half mutually contemptuous routine with the European Commission chief, Orbán returns serve by calling the Luxembourger “the Grand Duke.”
The Hungarian waves aside comparisons of his ruling style with the autocrat in Moscow and Turkey’s strong-handed leader as “ridiculous” and “a lazy way of thinking” — an insult that Western European politicians use to try to marginalize him.
“If I … disagree with them, they say, ‘You are not a democrat, you are not a good man, you belong to the bad guys’,” he says. Any time he breaks with the “very arrogant and aggressive” Western European “mainstream” on migration or another issue, he says, “we are morally labeled as xenophobic, Putin-type, whatever.”
PM Orbán on his relationship with President Putin and the national interests of Hungary:
“It’s strange, but politics is full of strange things, so it’s not uncomfortable,” Orbán says. “That’s part of the job. And you know politics is basically not a personal issue, and what I represent is not my opinion but the interests of the Hungarian nation. And the point is very clear, without the Russians it’s impossible to manage rightly the future of the Hungarians. So we have to have a good balanced relationship with the Russians.”
PM Orbán on being labeled a populist:
“Because I am,” he retorts. “The problem is nobody knows what [that] means. It does not sound bad in Hungarian ears. Being a populist means that you try to serve the people. It’s positive.”
Read the full text of the feature interview here.
