Another Experience with Mormons
Exciting Mormon news! One of our kiddos has been swapped out for a new one. I’m actually kind-of bummed about it because the one who left was my favorite, but this is the world we’re in now so what can you do?
This was a bit of a tense week. Again, I guess. There have been a few of those. This particular week the kiddos dived into the whole “pre-life” theology. I think we’re at the beginning of the second lesson, so at this rate we’re going to be doing this forever. As best I can gather, the idea is that we all existed as spirits for basically forever before, but then we got upset because of how we didn’t get to have a physical form like Jesus, and God agreed that was unfair so he decided to give us that opportunity. There was a lot of talk about how the experiences we have in our physical bodies are important for our someday ultimate happiness, but it was never at all clear why that would be true. Also we are apparently being tested down here to see if we choose God, although I’m a little vague on the point of the test, given that we apparently get to make the decision again once we die.
I did have something of a breakthrough or realization or something along those lines this time. I have really been struggling to figure out where I want to be in these conversations. My main goal in this was really to figure out how to have conversations about these topics more comfortably, but part of that requires me to have a goal. It doesn’t make sense for the goal to be changing their mind — that’s just silly, and I’ve never planned on that. Curiosity is a possibility but it’s disingenuous to pretend to be just curious about faiths that I definitely have opinions and feelings about (sometimes strong ones). What I think makes the most sense is to try to push on terms and meanings. One of the things about growing up religious is that there is so much language tied up in that. So much of growing up with any belief system is that it’s easy to not think about what you’re really saying — in fact sometimes you may not know, especially when you’re young. What I am finding myself most interested in is trying to push something to what it actually means and not just the religious talk around it. I don’t think it is the missionaries favorite thing, but I think it is important to know what you’re saying.
The big thing I drilled down on this time was the word “experiences.” I let them say it repeatedly for about five minutes before I jumped in. God sent us down to earth for experiences, our experiences on earth were critical, the experiences we have shape us, etc, etc. Finally I interjected to ask what they meant by experiences. Everything, as far as I could tell. Because for me, as I shared with them, I see two kids who most likely have had a lot of opportunities. They are young and white and male, they have maybe been raised in families that love them, they are maybe planning to go to college and pursue careers (I know that’s true for at least one of them). And those kinds of experiences seem like very easy things to pass off on God. Alternatively I work with kids whose lives are a lot different than that, who may have been physically or sexually assaulted as children, kicked out of their homes, raised by parents with chemical dependency issues, etc. And to say that those are experiences God has willed on them is a really different thing, and needs to be considered. I just think it’s unreasonable to put all “experiences” in the same boat. The newbie stuttered a little and said that he thought that “God knew us better than anyone and knew what we needed.” I asked him if he was saying that God knew that some kids needed to be beaten as children, because that is what it sounded like he was saying.
That’s when the other one jumped in and said something about free will. Obviously this has been a favorite of Christians in general for a long time, and is the same reason I grew up with. The problem is I’m not sure it holds water. David pointed out that if he was writing a story with a God who couldn’t interfere in human affairs, but who talked to a group of people directly (we could even call them Mormons), it would still make it easy to stop a lot of bad things. Why wasn’t God revealing to them a lot more to stop? At that point we got “God’s wisdom is higher” which is usually the end point.
I was once again this week struck by, and honestly still extremely confused by, how unprepared these kids are. I asked the new kid if Mormons believe in birth control, because I think it’s an interesting question in light of the idea of shepherding spirit babies into the world. I actually know the answer to that, at least my understanding is that the LDS church supports having as many children as you can adequately provide for but not more, so I assume the answer is yes? Which I actually think is a pretty responsible stance overall. But when I asked the question, the kid looked at me confused and said, “Huh… I don’t know. We don’t believe in abortion.” Which… cool. 1) I know that and 2) abortion is not birth control, but thanks for playing? Maybe it’s because he’s a guy, maybe I had more of an idea of these things because I was female and it applied more directly to me. But my core confusion remains. I feel like no matter what I ask these kids, they know remarkably little about the beliefs of their own church, much less any other church. Part of the reason I find this so baffling is because my experience growing up was so different. There were a lot of things I was told about growing up simply so that I would have the answer. If you know the answer you’re supposed to have, then you don’t listen to the question — it’s a good tactic. Sending these kids out into the world to hear things for the first time from people like me seems like bizarrely poor planning.
I was also very perplexed because our newb didn’t know anything about us. Do the missionaries not talk about the people they’re going to see regularly? Do they not have some kind of notes? Or at least like… I don’t know, pray or something before they go see people? A two minute rundown would have at least made sense, I would think. But it was clear this kid didn’t know who we were, didn’t know what we had been talking about. He came in very confident (he left a bit less so). He at one point asked David if he knew who Satan was, which… I tried not to laugh but I did not succeed. Again, it just seems sloppy! If you’re going to see people regularly and your people can be swapped out at any point, surely it makes sense to have some notes or something, something you can just hand people. I mean, this is literally part of my job. And while I don’t expect anything so detailed as what we do at my work, things like who we are, the fact that David was a pastor, the fact (I assume) that they think they have a chance with him, some of the types of questions we’ve asked… why not have these things?
I’m honestly left feeling like the goal of this isn’t to convert anyone. This feels like a checklist item for the boys and little more. With so little preparation seeming to go into it, perhaps converts are just a happy bonus. That said, they are still hoping David will come around. They prayed for him and not me at the beginning of this meeting, which mostly amused me. I mean, I don’t want to join your club boys, but it’s polite to extend invitations.
We’ve moved them to every other week, as I felt like it was taking up a bit more time than I had anticipated. That said, I took forever to write this entry so they’ll be back this coming Thursday. Maybe I’ll get to that entry sooner, who knows!