Hamburg 1’s interview with Moritz Schildt, the CEO of coinIX
Christian Pothe from Hamburg 1 Television interviewed Moritz Schildt, the co-founder and CEO of coinIX. Hamburg1 is the TV station for the Hamburg metropolitan region, providing daily updates on the city’s most important events.
Christian: ‘Could you tell us about your journey? what else do you do?’
Moritz: ‘I live in Hamburg and I’m a lawyer. I’ve spent most of my career in the traditional financial industry, working as an asset manager. In 2013, a friend introduced me to Bitcoin, which I found interesting because it was a currency that could be transferred digitally.
I was fascinated by this and, as can still be traced today thanks to the blockchain’s permanence, I bought my first Bitcoin on eBay in 2013. I paid about €25 for a quarter of a Bitcoin, but at that time, I didn’t even have a wallet. The seller asked where to send the quarter Bitcoin, and that’s how it all started. Over time, you go through several learning stages and understand things much better.
To this day, I’m still very impressed by this new technology, which allows us to transfer not just messages or images, but also assets like Bitcoin or, more recently, electronic securities as easily as sending a WhatsApp message.
The reason I’ve been increasingly involved in this topic on the side is that we started a small company that invests in crypto companies and various cryptocurrencies — not just Bitcoin, but many others as well. Here in Hamburg, we also founded a small association called the Hanseatic Blockchain Institute. Eventually, someone approached me and said there’s an industry association for the blockchain industry in Germany, called Bundesblock, based in Berlin. They asked if I would like to join the board.’
Christian: ‘what exactly is a cryptocurrency and what is a blockchain?’
Moritz: ‘This could easily fill an entire evening, and it depends a lot on the starting point. To simplify, we’re used to storing data in databases today. For example, my account balance at Deutsche Bank is stored in a database managed by Deutsche Bank. The basic idea behind Bitcoin was to create a digital system capable of not only storing information but also things like account balances. This database is decentralized — everyone can have a copy of it and transparently view it. This has led to the development of blockchain technology, which allows us to transfer assets like Bitcoin as easily as sending a WhatsApp message.
What’s revolutionary here is that this transaction happens without a bank or intermediary. Unlike PayPal, which profits from user data, blockchain doesn’t have a central authority that monetizes data. Blockchain knows how much cryptocurrency is in my wallet but doesn’t know my identity — it’s pseudonymous rather than completely anonymous.
There are many examples where this technology has been both transparent and abused. In the past, the hype around crypto led to significant gains and also to fraudulent activities. Some exchanges promised huge returns or launched altcoins that ended up being scams, hurting the reputation of legitimate players in the market.
Christian: ‘what about the regulatory frameworks?’
Moritz: ‘In 2014, quite early on, I spoke with the German regulator, BaFin, because we were already considering launching a fund that would invest in crypto assets. Back then, BaFin made it very clear that they would find ways to prevent it, simply because they saw it as something entirely dangerous. Since then, the perception has completely changed. Not only has BaFin developed a very competent unit that also offers advisory support, but the German legislature has already established a regulatory framework over the past few years. For example, the creation of the licensing requirement for crypto custodians, which is essentially like a small bank where you can hold crypto assets if you don’t want to set up a wallet yourself. And then, there’s been a significant development for Europe — the MiCA (Markets in Crypto-Assets) directive, which is a regulation that will come into force across Europe in part by the 17th and fully by the end of the year. This regulation creates a legal framework for the issuance, trading, and handling of tokens and service providers in this field.
Christian: ‘How do you see the future use cases?’
Moritz: ‘ I always like to tell the story of how, in 1998, someone told me they had bought Amazon shares. At the time, Amazon was still very early in its development, and I asked what Amazon did because I wasn’t familiar with it. They said it was an online bookstore. I thought about it and told this friend, who later joined the board of Expedia and had a very early vision of digitalization, “Technically, I can see that working, but I can’t imagine people buying books online. Good luck with Amazon!” And then, the stock dropped by a third. It was a long journey, and I think we’re in a similar phase now. We have a technology with enormous potential to be truly disruptive in many areas, especially in the financial sector. We’re still in the early stages, and honestly, no one has a clear idea of where the big developments and applications will be — the “use case” that will really drive this forward.
Nevertheless, the financial sector in Germany has now taken significant interest. All major banks have blockchain and cryptocurrency on their agenda. The KfW (Kreditanstalt für Wiederaufbau) recently issued a bond with a volume of 100 million euros that was tokenized. This is a security without paper, digitally transferable, and unlike traditional securities transactions, it doesn’t take two days to settle (as in the “T+2” rule where it takes two days to deliver securities to the buyer’s account). This tokenized bond can be transferred almost instantly, like sending a WhatsApp message. You just press a button, and the transaction is completed with a “pling” on the recipient’s end.
While this may sound trivial, all major banks have now realized that this is revolutionary. In many cases, we also see that, theoretically, transactions could work without banks because, in this decentralized system, transactions can be conducted directly between end-users, without an intermediary. Ultimately, it’s about digital trust. For the first time, we don’t have to wonder whether an online source is fake or hacked, or whether the information has been manipulated. With blockchain, we have a technology that allows us to store data in a way that’s tamper-proof.
This could potentially replace all the current processes where we rely on stamps or signatures. We’ll see certificates, diplomas, and even waste disposal records on the blockchain. Shipping documents, which are still often faxed and stamped today, will also move to this system. Some might argue that they’re already digital, but current digitization still involves storing data in an SQL server by a provider, and there’s always an administrator who could delete, suppress, or alter a record. Now, we have a technology that allows us to store data in a tamper-proof manner, and I believe that this will have an enormous impact.
When, where, and how exactly? I don’t know for sure. But I think we’ll start seeing significant developments in the next 24 to 36 months. The comparison to Amazon is quite fitting, and it highlights how this is something that should also be recognized by politicians. We often talk about missed opportunities, and this is a clear case where understanding and seizing the potential is crucial.
Christian: ‘What about the politics?’
Moritz: ‘It has already arrived in politics; there are representatives in Berlin who are addressing this issue. There was actually a paper about three years ago called the “Blockchain Strategy of the Federal Government.The entire blockchain industry in Germany, or the startups involved, were very enthusiastic at that time because the federal government made a strong commitment. I had a representative from the USA, who was a digital advisor to the White House, visiting at that time, and he expressed great respect for the clear commitment from Germany.
It was announced that the prerequisites for electronic securities, for example, would be included, which has since been accomplished. However, I still have the impression that, in the broad spectrum of the German Bundestag and politics, it remains a peripheral issue with only a small handful of politicians recognizing the potential and trying to advance it.
In contrast, in Lucerne, for example, with significant public funding — around 20 million Swiss Francs — a blockchain center has been established at a university to help the financial industry promote blockchain’s potential in the financial sector. We definitely don’t see such initiatives in Germany yet, and this personally frustrates me because I see the potential as very high and believe that Germany, which is known for its trustworthiness worldwide, should be at the forefront of digital trust. We have a great opportunity to not miss out on this next wave of digitalization and to create a location where, perhaps, some foreigners might say they will issue their token in Germany under German standards and regulation.
Christian: ‘What about other countries?’
Moritz: ‘ Switzerland is extremely well-positioned because there is a lot of capital and a strong awareness of the potential. Liechtenstein and Luxembourg are active, but due to their size, they are not as prominent. It is sad that in France, for example, I recently attended a conference in Paris where we were invited by the Finance Minister, who gave a speech saying that they want to support the potential they see.
There is an association of the digital asset community in France, which includes major banks and has been actively exploring potential for three years, having supported startups with eight-figure amounts. The French KfW also has its own blockchain promotion program.
In contrast, we are still a bit behind in Germany. The new EU Commission, which is currently being reformed, might have approaches for projects. The MiCA regulation was a significant step towards a common legal framework, but when it comes to establishing industry, there seems to be a competition between locations. One of the largest American issuers of a stablecoin — a cryptocurrency that is not as volatile as Bitcoin, whose value is pegged to the Dollar or Euro — decided to establish its headquarters in France rather than Frankfurt. This should be a wake-up call for Germany.
We need to create conditions where this new wave of digitalization feels comfortable. We need to have an administration that not only acts through administrative procedures with seven-page documents and prohibitions but also engages in dialogue and perhaps says, “I would recommend you do it this way or that way.” We have a standard application form and can share a bit about how we can help companies utilize the potential of this completely new technology without risking conflicts with BaFin.
Christian: ‘How is the Blockchain stimulating the german economy?’
Moritz: ‘Last year, we received funding from the German Bundestag for a study by the Hansartic Blockchain Institute. This study, called W3NOW aims to answer this question: (how many companies in which industries are currently using blockchain and what are their experiences with it)
In the first step, we conducted a survey with the ifo Institute, which showed that about 15% of companies in Germany that participated in the survey either already use blockchain or have it in their planning. I found that not so bad, but it shows that we are still in a very early stage.
In the second part of the study, we surveyed companies that are actively working with blockchain. We wanted to learn more about their experiences, focus areas, implementation strategies, and obstacles. We are now in the third phase of the study, developing recommendations for action, which we are verifying with experts. We also want to understand and share the experiences and projects of large companies like Deutsche Telekom, Lufthansa, SAP, Bosch, and Hugo Boss, which are already deeply involved with blockchain, as well as smaller companies that are actively working on it.
It’s really a lot about collaboration — where it’s no longer about a company saying, “I have this great product and I’m selling it to everyone,” but rather opening up with a common standard, a common platform, a common protocol, and sharing data. And honestly, maybe as a side note, especially for this megatrend of artificial intelligence, where everyone says the result of an AI is only as good as the data it’s fed with, and everyone wonders how to ensure that the data is reliable and tamper-proof. I believe there is a great potential here. We recently conducted a study on behalf of the Konrad Adenauer Foundation showing that these two technologies — artificial intelligence and blockchain technology — together have even greater potential as a guarantee for data quality.
Christian: ‘Are there any politicians who are particularly focused on Blockchain?’
Moritz: ‘The FDP is dealing with digitalization and blockchain issues. We have also noted interest from the Federal Ministry of Justice in creating a legal framework for digital assets within German civil law. It’s fascinating because, although the German Civil Code (BGB) is 100 years old, it only covers tangible assets and regulates how to transfer and sell things, while digital assets, which cannot be touched, are not covered by the BGB. These are very positive developments. Additionally, the major initiative to support startups. there are probably 200 to 300 startups in Germany focusing on blockchain.
Christian: ‘Is Blockchain energy-intensive?’
Moritz: ‘This is indeed one of the most frequent criticisms, particularly against blockchain technology. Bitcoin is the dinosaur; it’s the first, largest, but also the most cumbersome in the realm of cryptocurrencies. The mechanism that ensures the security of the Bitcoin blockchain involves performing a lot of calculations, which are then archived, leading to relatively high electricity consumption. This is definitely true. Anyone who says this is bad might be comparing it to an investment in security. It’s an investment in maintaining security.
Christian: ‘Currently, the focus is on business-related use cases. What about the average citizens?’
Moritz: ‘I recommend everyone to try it out. We recently held a workshop in Hamburg called “My First Wallet,” where we showed participants, especially from the finance sector in Hamburg, how easy it is to set up a wallet and use it. You can scan a QR code and transfer funds within seconds. I recommend everyone to try this with their family. It’s fascinating and special because we’re used to having a central authority for passwords. If you forget your password, you can call and have it reset. With blockchain, that doesn’t work. The wallet is purely digital, and the world is moving in a direction where, for digital trust to work, there can no longer be a phone number where someone says they’ll reset everything or delete all your data. We need to get used to this idea.
For larger amounts, I recommend involving a professional service because managing passwords is something to think about. If you have an accident, as we say in Hamburg, you should ensure that this password, which ideally no one else should see, can be accessed by your heirs if needed. Currently, there isn’t a perfectly secure method for this, so it might make sense to invest in a fund or find a service where you can, in case of inheritance, show the certificate of inheritance and recover your Bitcoins.
There are two Bitcoin ATMs in Hamburg where you can actually create a wallet, insert a bill, and the amount will be credited to your wallet. Many other providers allow you to buy Bitcoins or other cryptocurrencies with your credit card, which will then be transferred to your wallet.
You can open an account at a crypto exchange, transfer money there, and trade, similar to a securities broker where you also have a broker account. There is a very broad spectrum of possibilities, and at the end of the day, I think it will become clear which method is the simplest.
Interestingly, the transition from off-chain to on-chain — moving from traditional money to cryptocurrency — is currently the biggest hurdle. It’s not always trivial. For instance, if I make profits on a crypto exchange and want to exchange this money back into euros and transfer it to my bank account, there are banks in Germany that may refuse such transactions, citing potential issues.
You can’t go to an ATM where you can deposit cash and get money out with your wallet. In other countries, like Canada, it’s relatively advanced; you can choose to have transactions deducted from your bank account or charged to your credit card. In Germany, as far as I know, this is not yet permitted.
I believe the focus should be on industry applications and then on securities business — tokenized securities and capital investments. This includes participating in real estate and tokenizing former gray market assets, such as vintage car collections and wine collections. This will eventually be done through tokenization. The charm is that you can decide on an investment on your smartphone over the weekend, and previously, you would have had to go to the bank on Monday to sign a subscription form and transfer the amount. Now, you can just press a button, and the security or share in the fund is instantly in your wallet.
For a younger generation, this is an enormous advantage. They will simply say, “I’ll do my tax return on my phone, and I’ll handle my investments on my phone.” I believe that, in the end, these young people won’t need a securities depot in their lives. They won’t need an investor or Allianz stock for their retirement savings because they will manage everything in tokenized format with digital, possibly more conservative investment products.
Banks need to prepare for this. Ideally, values will move up or down within this system, and in Germany, this also has tax implications. The financial and tax authorities have relatively clear guidelines now, not just on capital gains and their taxation, but also on how to handle interest earned from cryptocurrencies through staking.
At local tax offices, those who are completely honest and want to declare everything and prepare accordingly often encounter tax officials who do not understand all of this, which leads to additional costs. This will be standardized piece by piece. There is a company called CryptoTax that automates this process. Since wallets are publicly accessible, if I know my wallet addresses, I can input them into my tax software, which then automatically searches not only the balances but also all transactions from the past year, processes them, and generates a tax calculation. So, it’s much simpler, more straightforward, and more transparent. Tax officials can directly check the wallet to see what has happened. These are aspects that show the future is coming, but the path is still a bit rocky.
Christian: ‘How can people learn more about this topic?’
Moritz: ‘There are local initiatives in almost all cities in Germany. In Hamburg, we have the Hansartic Blockchain Institute, where we have been hosting Blockchain Monday events for four years. Every Monday evening, we hold virtual and physical events with experts discussing relatively complex topics. We also cover topics like intellectual property on the blockchain and NFTs (non-fungible tokens), where projects are regularly presented. We collaborate with universities, such as the Business Law School, and have held joint seminars. Currently, these events are open to everyone, but we are in the process of tokenizing our membership. Access to certain resources will soon be available only to those with a membership token. This token will serve as a key to specific content accessible only to members. This is a project we are working on.
However, these are still mostly private initiatives. The number of universities in Germany actively offering blockchain courses is still relatively small. In Frankfurt, there’s a location, and in Munich, there’s a professor advancing the topic. In Berlin, it’s still quite scattered.
If someone in Hamburg wants to organize a workshop for their executives or similar, we have a network of experienced speakers who can present various aspects across different industries. I personally find it incredibly exciting to advance this topic.
Christian: ‘What about Data security?’
Moritz: ‘It’s always difficult to predict the future, but the charm of decentralized technology is that as long as there is a functioning computer somewhere in the world — and it’s said that Bitcoin data is even stored on satellites orbiting the Earth — data should be recoverable. As long as there is one computer somewhere with data still available and synchronized, it can be restored. There is no risk of losing data because there is always a form of control. The entire blockchain is verified for its integrity similar to a digital fingerprint. Even if someone manipulates the blockchain, it can be detected.’
Christian: ‘What are your three wishes for the next 12 months?’
Moritz: ‘I would wish for the sentiment towards blockchain technology, which is not just about the technology but also about the vision behind it from individuals who want to build projects based on collaboration, where systems are built to include stakeholders, and where employees are paid with tokens, suppliers are paid with tokens, and infrastructures are created. This is very exciting because it eliminates intermediaries like Google and Facebook, which profit from our data.
I hope that this idea continues to gain awareness. I also hope that in Berlin, the political climate will not just passively observe this phenomenon positively but actively support it by providing funds for research, startups, and building hubs. Currently, the W3 Hub in Berlin is privately funded, and the public sector has not yet provided support.
Finally, the sentiment for this technology and our fund is still heavily dependent on Bitcoin’s price, which is influenced by supply and demand. I would also wish for Bitcoin’s price to rise to 100,000 by the end of the year.
Watch the origibal interview on YouTube:
About coinIX Capital GmbH
Since 2017, coinIX Capital GmbH, headquartered in Hamburg, has been at the forefront of analyzing blockchain projects and cryptocurrencies, facilitating investments in this dynamic sector. Comprising specialists with extensive experience in asset management, venture capital, and cutting-edge technology analysis, the coinIX team manages a portfolio boasting over 20 investments in blockchain startups alongside crypto assets. Shares of coinIX GmbH & Co. KGaA are listed on the free market of the Düsseldorf Stock Exchange and are also traded on the Berlin and Munich stock exchanges.
About coinIX COINVEST SCI1
Launched in June 2022, coinIX COINVEST SCI1 is an open domestic special AIF under the KAGB. As a sub-portfolio of coinIX COINVEST Investment Stock Corporation with variable capital, its assets are managed by coinIX Capital GmbH, acting as a registered capital management company. Available for subscription by professional or semi-professional investors, the fund has the flexibility to invest up to 100% of its capital in crypto assets, aiming for a diversified portfolio of digital assets actively managed through ongoing selection processes. Additional income streams are generated through staking and other blockchain-native mechanisms. With the ISIN DE000A408Q55, subscriptions to the fund are only available directly through the investment company, with private investor acquisition prohibited.
Check out mwb Research Update of coinIX:
