I hear you, but I want to remind us that there are both men and women in that camp that you highlight. That is not really a gender issue, but an issue nevertheless. That said, some people very much prove they deserve the recognition — they are just exposed to engineering in a different style and if they have the right aptitude for it, can master it! Just because someone had years of learning does not automatically qualify them for titles and salaries. Or vice-versa. Evaluating performance has its own set of issues, but it’s quite a bit different from what we are discussing here.