The Definitive Breeze-”The Young Son Of No One” 30th Anniversary Interview + Album Breakdown (Featuring Muffla of L.A. Posse)
“This business is crazy man. I kind of fell out of favor with it for a little bit, but now I’m starting to get back into something.”-Breeze (September 2019)
That above quote is something Breeze said to me at the start of our interview, which took place in late Summer 2019. I’ve been trying to interview him since at least the mid 90s, but had been unable to track him down, and when I finally did in about 2015, we were unable to lock in a time to make it happen. But, I finally reconnected with him in 2019, and it was important for me to do that being it is the 30 Year Anniversary of his only album, “The Young Son Of No One”.
I remember buying that album and being a huge fan of it, and I still listen to it regularly (though I never cared for “Girls On My Mind” or “Great Big Freak”, but the rest of the album still gets heavy play). It had commercial appeal, but it was also raw. Breeze had an impressive flow and delivery, but his writing was also top notch. He sounded so seasoned on the mic. I remember my girlfriend at the time, Tracey Hunt, told me about his video for “L.A. Posse” and that he had the smooth dance moves. He was essentially the full package for an MC and an entertainer, and because of that, I suspected he would have a long and prosperous career. Instead, he released the one album and then spent the next couple decades only popping up for a handful of guest appearances, and releasing a rare 12” in ’92, that I’ve been trying to get ever since then and still haven’t attained. It’s also of note that every time that he did pop up, he was incredibly on point with his skills.
He’s rhymed on songs with legends and fan favorites such as Ice Cube, Xzibit, The Lixx, and King Tee, and arguably walked away with the best verse every time. He’s a craftsman, so I wanted to get deep into the details of his history, his album, and what happened next.
That is all meticulously discussed below with Breeze and Muffla of L.A. Posse, who produced most of the music he released. I’ve done a lot of interviews in my life, more than I could ever count probably, and currently this one is sitting as a favorite because of how candid they were both willing to be. Often times, artists are reserved on speaking about certain subjects, worried about what feathers they might ruffle, or how their comments might be taken by some. But, here, Breeze and Muffla speak freely. Plus, the L.A. Posse, have always been very outspoken, even in critiques of themselves and of their friends/associates, which Muffla also does here, with his off cuff humorous demeanor, offering some critical thoughts on Breeze’s career, many of which are basically in line with some of Breeze’s on assessments.Yet, those critiques and comments, though true, are expressed with love and often hilarity.
L.A. Posse in mind, a large shout out to Big Dad who I interviewed several years ago and was the initial connection for me being able to finally talk to Breeze and Muffla. I interviewed them all on three separate occasions, which makes it even more impressive that even after all these years, all three of their stories on their history all largely perfectly line up, which is honesty a rarity in my line of work.
Kevin: Where were you born and raised?
Breeze: Originally I’m from New York. I was born in New York. I was raised in the Bronx, lived there till I was about fourteen/fifteen. Then, I moved to LA in like ’84.
Kevin: What is your earliest Hip Hop memory?
Breeze: Well, I was there from the inception. When “Rappers Delight” and all that came out it was like a new thing to everybody, so I jumped into it with two feet, as far as being a fan.
I grew up going to the parks, to the jams, listening to the Cold Crush, the Fantastic Five, Busy Bee…stuff like that, that’s what I grew up on. Originally, before I left (New York) I was just listening to it. I wasn’t really rapping yet, besides rapping along to their lyrics. I was fan. I didn’t start trying to do my own thing until I came to Cali cause (not a lot of people were) really doing it here, and I had a head-start and a jump on everybody, so I figured that’s when I should start doing my own thing.
Kevin: Who were your initial influences?
Breeze: My first favorite rapper of all time was Grandmaster Caz of the Cold Crush Brothers. That was my man right there. The first rhymes I was writing you can (hear the Caz influence). I was using his words…everything, until I developed my own thing.
Kevin: From that point, how did you start to build your skills?
Breeze: When I first started take it serious, my whole thing was like, “I’m battling everybody!’ Anybody.” I would go to High Schools, Radiotron, all kind of little clubs out in LA, Sherman Square Roller Rink, World On Wheels. I was rapping everywhere, and I was looking for battles. That’s basically how I harnessed my skills, by doing it that way.
Kevin: Do you have any key battle memories? Any with anyone that people might know?
Breeze: Not really of people that are well known now, but I will tell you about a quick, funny one. The first REAL battle I was going to have was with Ice-T. We were at Sherman Square Roller Rink…think it was about ’86. Ice-T already had “Reckless” out…he was a known artist. There used to be a roller rink in the valley called Sherman Square where everybody used to go. Ice-T was performing up there, and (at some point at the show) he said, ‘Anybody who thinks they have rap skills, come up to the mic and I’m going to give you a few minutes to do y’all thing’. Like twenty people lined up, and I was probably like number fifteen. Everybody (before me) went up and do their little bars or whatever, and right as I was about to grab the mic, I guess Ice got tired of all the wackness that was going on, and he straight looked me dead in my face and he said, “Anybody else that want to come up here and rap, I got one suggestion for you (and he looked me DEAD in my face and said)…go make a record”. I went home that night and I think I wrote three battle raps for him, and I was searching for him, for like YEARS! To get my get back. But, it never happened, and then later on we finally linked up and I met him, that’s when I was doing my own thing, with L.A. Posse, but I was still part of Rhyme Syndicate (management). Ice became sort of like one of my mentors in this game.
Kevin: How did you connect with Big Dad and Muffla (who eventually became the L.A. Posse?
Breeze: I was going to a high school across the street from Big Dad’s girlfriend’s house. I was friends with his girlfriend’s little brother, my boy Joey. Joey knew that Big Dad and Muffla were part of Uncle Jamm’s Army and trying to get their rap (careers) together, so he (said to Big Dad), ‘I got a boy that can rap’. So, I came over the house one day and I rapped for (Big Dad), and he liked what I did and he called Muffla, and he was like, ‘Yo Muff, I got somebody that can rhyme…’, and Muff was like, “Yeah, whatever”. Then, finally maybe a couple weeks later, Muffla was doing some kind of jam out in (the) valley and I went out there to rap. There, I got to rap for Muffla, but also in front of a crowd, and then from there we linked up. It wasn’t even (called) L.A. Posse, it was just us (three). After that, we went to the BRE Music Conference, and that’s when we got to play our music for Russell Simmons and got the invite to go to New York. But, once we got out to New York, nobody knew what to call us, so it was Jam Master Jay, one day in the car with him and Jay said, “What do y’all call y’all self?” And, we were like, “We don’t call ourselves nothing”. He was like, “I’m gonna start calling y’all the L.A. Posse”, so Jam Master Jay actually came up with the name.
Kevin: Do you remember what songs you played for Russell Simmons that day?
Breeze: I did a (song) called “Popcorn!” It was a (demo) from the old chant, “On and on to the break-a-dawn/Like hot butter on what, the popcorn!” The (song) was kinda hot. I did that and this other one called “My Def Beat”. We played those two songs for him in the middle of the Universal Hilton hotel lobby, and after he heard that, he was like, “I want to fly y’all out to New York and do some work”.
Kevin: When I interviewed Big Dad a few years ago, he told me that you recorded ALOT of demos for Def Jam and none of them ever got released. Do you have memories of any of them?
Breeze: We probably recorded at least forty something songs for Def Jam (between 1986–1988). A lot of the songs we did were dope, but the one thing that I remember vividly is that every time we went to the studio to make a song, then we would play it for Russell. He would always go crazy over the song when he first heard it. The next day, he would still be crazy over it, and then two or three days later, he’d call us and be like, “It’s not a song…it’s not a song”. I got tired of him playing this Jedi Mind Trick with us, so I wrote this song called “Played Out”. Basically, I wrote a diss record about the label that I was on (Def Jam), but unless you really (studied) the lyrics, you didn’t know what I was talking about, so Russell would be bobbing his head like, “Yo, that shit is hot!” But, Bill Stepney is the one that pulled me to the side, and he was like, “Breeze, I don’t know if anyone else is catching what you’re doing, but I know what you’re saying in that record, and you’re basically dissin’ Def Jam”. And, I’m like, wow, you figured it out. That is the one that I wished would’ve came out.
Another one that I remember prominently, if you remember “Run’s House” (by Run-DMC), I had a record called “Tear The House Down”. It had Michael Jackson going, “We could tear the house down. We can tear the whole house down” from (Jackson Five “Enjoy Yourself”). That record was really dope, and Run basically came to me and said, “Yo, I want to use that hook. Your shit ain’t coming out so let me use it”. I was like, “NO!”. I was on some…whatever…just no. So, what he did was, “Run’s House” has that little part that they would say, “Run’s House” and it would say “Party People in the house” with Slick Rick’s voice, that was part of the hook (to “Tear The House Down”, so (Run) took that little piece, but he didn’t take the rest of the song.
There are a bunch of songs I did (for Def Jam), but those are two that I vividly remember.
EDITOR’S NOTE: I don’t know what part he’s talking about in “Run’s House”. There is a part where they use Slick Rick saying “MCcccc” from “La Di Da Di”, so maybe it’s that, or possible he knows of a different (perhaps a demo version) of the song, or maybe that “party people in the house” thing is something they did in the live show.
Kevin: What are some of the first highlight moments you remember from your time going back to New York after getting signed to Def Jam?
Breeze: Well, the one thing I can tell you as far as about that, we were in New York probably, if I’m not mistaken, I think I got signed in 1985. I think I think I was like in 10th grade, the summer of the 10th grade. So, I think it was like ’85 or something like that. And, by 86, I don’t know when the Raisin’ Hell tour was, but the Raisin’ Tour had came out, and I got to ride on the bus and go to a couple of shows. I think I did DC and I did another place. (This was) before I was doing shows or anything, but I just remember my first experience of being on the stage with all these big heavyweights at the end of the show. It was Run-DMC Whodini, LL, Beastie Boys, a lot of people on the show, but at the end of the show, Run would always call everybody out for the curtain call, and (on this particular night) Russell was like, “Yo, run up on stage, go and see what it feels like?” So, I remember going up on stage and they had like a big wall of speakers on both sides of the stage and I remember, when you come up the back of the stairs, the speakers block you (from the crowd). So, you take a few steps, and all of a sudden and…we was in, I think, the Capital Center, United Center, whatever that big stadium was in DC, I think it was DC. And, I just remember coming from behind the wall of the speakers and looking out and seeing 18,000 people. And, I took two steps and froze. I froze and I walked back behind the speakers, and Darryl…Big Dad looked at me and he was like, “What are you doing? He’s like, go, go!” I remember, I walked out and I stayed waayyyy in the back by Jam Master Jay. Then, about a minute passed by, so now I’m starting to feel myself, so now I’m starting to walk towards the front of the stage like, “Yeah, I’m about to get my shine!” And, then the show was over and they cut the music off. (laughs)
And, I was like the last one off the stage, I was like I’m still getting my two seconds of glory right now though.
Kevin: I was always curious about this, with New York being the home of Hip Hop they were kind of slow to adapt to some things. For one, I always found it interesting that LL in 1985 after his first album, he’s like one of the hottest rappers on the planet. And, at that time New York really didn’t respect or acknowledge any West Coast Rap really…
Breeze: Not at all.
Kevin: So, it’s always been crazy to me that Russell Simmons paired LL for his next album with a West Coast production unit. Do you have a perspective on why that happened?
Breeze: Well, you know what, it’s funny that you said that, you know, the whole story behind the LL thing (being paired with LA Posse), I think the reason why that happened was, you know, the music is kind of universal a little bit, but I mean, they still had a little West Coast feel about it. But, I have a joke about all this, and I sometimes I think, if I ever bump into LL again, I would say to him, “Yo, you know, I’m like partially responsible for your success”. Not really, because he was already a star anyway, and no shade at all, but my whole thing is like this, (LL) got “Bigger And Deffer” from L.A. Posse because I was on the label (Def Jam) with him and all the records I was doing, you know people (at the label and who were around) were loving the music I was doing, (LL) was recording (his) stuff and Russell one day just said (to L.A. Posse), “Yo, LL’s doing his next album now, why don’t you go to the studio and do something for L”, and it started from there. And, then all the sudden, they basically did the whole album. So, that’s why I always say, if it wasn’t for me being signed, (LL) wouldn’t have had Dwayne (Muffla), Bobcat and everybody else like that producing his next album, although he probably would have still found somebody else and still did his own thing, but he might have never had “I’m Bad”. He would have never had “I Need Love” cause these are songs that they (LL Posse and LL) came up with together. So, you know, I think that he’s dope, but at the same time, you gotta kind of look at it as (at that time) I’m like competition to him. So, it was like (Def Jam) already had a dude that does what I’m doing that’s already popular. And, so they essentially linked the two together. One thing that I did have was support from the people that were on the label, like Run, DMC, Jam Master Jay, Davy D…all of them used to have my demos. I don’t know how they always had my music, but they always had my music, and Run used to tell me, “Yo, we bang your shit in Hollis (Queens), like everybody in Hollis know who you are.” And, Run told me, he told me straight up, he was like, “Yo, I don’t know what kind of trip my brother’s on but he’s tripping, you should be out.” So, I didn’t really get support from DJs (at that time) because I didn’t have nothing to play or nothing like that, but I did get a lot of support from the artists I was working with, or who was on Def Jam or under Rush Management, one or the other.
Kevin: So, I saw the post you had on your Facebook page, talking about the friendly competition between you and LL. Can you share some specific memories of you two rhyming together or anything about those times?
Breeze: Well, yeah, you saw we got a thing called Def Jam Chronicles, and there’s more to come on that too cause I got other funny stories. But, to give you a quick little definition of it… It was funny because like I said on that (Facebook video), it was like, we know each other, but LL was his own person. And, you know, he was more friendly with (LA Posse), I wasn’t really friends with him. And, you know, we happened to all be together at our little apartment in Brooklyn, you know, we was having a bagging session and you know, I was kind of getting the best of him. And you know, what he told me was, in the middle of it (LL said), “Yeah, you can crack jokes, but can you rap.” Now mind you, if he would have went back to my room in LA right then, he would’ve saw his pictures on my wall. That would have really made it funny, right? So, I froze at that point. I was like, damn, this is LL, I looked up to him. And, Bobcat was my DJ at the time. And, Bobcat told me…he was like “Come here. I want to talk to you”, and we went into the bathroom. And, when we were in the bathroom, he straight up told me, “ YO, if you don’t go back out here right now and battle him, I don’t want to DJ for you no more. Cuz I believe in you and you need to believe in yourself.” And he was like, “On top of that, if I didn’t think you could hang with him, I would tell you that you shouldn’t say nothing.” So, like I said in my Def Jam Chronicles video, I had my little Eminem moment right there were I was like (to myself), “OK, what are you gonna do?” And I was like, OK, I got it together. I went out there and stepped to him like, “Yo, let’s go!” Bobcat had the two turntables in the living room and he put on (the instrumental from) “Play This Only At Night” by Doug E. Fresh. And, we just started going in. And, the cool part about it was, like every rap I would spit, he would spit a rap just like that. Like, if I kicked a freestyle rap talking about myself, his next rap was a freestyle rap talking about his-self. He came out with a rap about a girl, I came back with one. I think we went like three rounds. And then after that was over, you know, he looked me in the face and he said, “OK, yo, you can rap”. And, then I remember that day, we were friends for ONE DAY. We left. We went downstairs, we went to the liquor store. We got some 40s, we were standing out on the street corner drinking 40s. I remember when we went in the store, the dude (working) was like, “Yo, you look like LL”, and (LL) was like, “Yeah, everybody tells me that, but that’s not me”. He had just got that little Audi with the bulletproof windows and the remote control car stereo, so we were like BUDDIES for like two hours. After that, the next day, business as usual because, I mean, come on man, you know MCing is still a sport, and we still looked at each other as like, you know, even though we’re cool, you’re still the adversary, know what I mean? So, you know, it went back to business as usual, but you know, it is what it is. I don’t hold no grudge. No animosity. I wish I would bump into him today just to see if he would even acknowledge it.
Kevin: That first time I heard you was on “Just Clowing” on King Tee’s “Act A Fool” album (’88), so just to make sure, was that your debut?
Breeze: Yeah, that was my first joint. I mean I was friends with King Tee probably since like ’87, like somewhere around there. They used to have this store around Pacoima, CA called The Fila Shop, and everybody used to go up there to get their clothes made, and (the owner of that store) he was like the West Coast Dapper Dan. So, you know you made the Gucci and Louie suits and all that, so I became friends with (King Tee) way back then. And, everybody knew me as the ‘little rap dude from New York, but he’s out here in California and he’s with Def Jam and all that’ so, you know, I got a lot of shine from that. And, (King Tee and I) forged a friendship, and then when it came time to do “Just Clowning”, he called me and asked if I’d jump on the record with him, and I’m like, of course, you know what I’m saying? Because I was a fan of his as well.
Kevin: You mentioned on the “Just Clowing” track, “I only lay my voice on a track the Pooh cut” and you have another line about Pooh on your song “T.Y.S.O.N” (“I’m good at what I do and Pooh’s my sparring partner”), so at some point were you intending on doing more music with Pooh as your producer, rather than Muffla and Big Dad of LA Posse?
Breeze: Me and Pooh was cool, but he was more DJing for King Tee, and King Tee was also messing with Keith Cooley, Joe’s (Cooley) brother. So, what happened is when I was basically shelved with doing records not going nowhere on Def Jam…I think this was when LA Posse was doing “Go Cut Creator Go” for (LL Cool J), they had Cut Creator trying to do the scratches and I guess whatever Cut Creator was doing wasn’t what they were looking for whatever. So, Darryl (Big Dad) and Dwayne (Muffla) was like, “Well, let’s get (Bobcat) to come down here and do it.” So, they said Bob came in there and he was like lightweight doing it a little bit, and Big Dad told him, “Stop playing and give them that real.” So, that’s when he gave them what you hear on “Go Cut Creator Go” (for the scratches). So, what happened was, obviously, I’m not doing nothing (in terms of having records out) and so LL asked Bobcat to be his DJ. And so Bob was like, “Well, you know, I DJ for Breeze”. And, you know, that same old competitive shit, (LL said something to the effect), “That nigga ain’t doing nothing…”. I don’t know if that was quite the words, but it was either (LL saying) “He ain’t doing nothing” or “Until he does something, why don’t you DJ for me”. And from what I hear, and I don’t know if this is all true, but I know most of it is true, LL brought (Bobcat) two Technic 1200s, gave him five grand and a bunch of Troop sweatsuits, cuz you know, he had the Troop sponsorship. So, Bob came to me and he was like, “Yo, Breeze, check this out, LL asked me to DJ for him…”, yada yada…and he was like like, “I’m going to still be down with you…”, but he was like, “ Yo, if you tell me no, I won’t do it.” And, I looked at Bob and I was like, “Yo, check this out bruh. You’ve been DJing as long as I’ve been rapping, if you got a shot to go do something, I wouldn’t even feel right trying to hold you back from anything you trying to do.” So I said, “Man, go ahead.” He said, “Yo, you know what else I’m gonna do is…I’m not just gonna leave you hanging, you know, Pooh?” And I’m like, “Yeah”. He said, “I’m gonna get Pooh to DJ for you.” and I said, “Okay, cool.” So, at that point, remember, I’m still on Def Jam. So me and Pooh did a bunch of records while I was on Def Jam, but, once again, nothing really happened from it, and then you know, once my deal was over, you know, Pooh was still doing his stuff out here we King Tee and various artists out here, so you know, so it didn’t really work out with him being my DJ. But, we always kept in touch, always been cool and stuff like that.
Kevin: That in mind, when you were working on all these demos for Def Jam, who were all the producers you worked with?
Breeze: Most of it was just LA Posse, DJ Pooh, Bobcat did a few. I’m don’t really remember working with nobody outside my circle. Not at that time.
Kevin: Then, how did the deal with Atlantic Records come about?
Breeze: Unfortunately, I guess Def Jam wasn’t on top of their business as far as my contract was concerned. Remember, when I signed my contract, I was 16 years old. So, my mom had to sign my contract for me. And, it’s not like they could sign me for a long time because I was still a minor. So basically, my contract was for two years, but it had an option. And, they failed to pick up the option and the deadline had passed. And, I guess they didn’t even know. So, what happened was, I got a lawyer to look at my contract and my lawyer said, “Well, you know, right now, you’re still on the label, but you’re really not officially signed. You can leave and do what you want to do because your period is up. So it was like, oh, okay, so then, you know, we got out of the deal. And, then I don’t know really how the Atlantic deal came up because that was like, you know, Darryl and Dwayne. They had a lawyer, Steve Shapiro, and in fact, I heard Steve is still doing this thing out there. And, I think Steve actually linked up and got that deal for them, but they got it as a production deal off the strength of the work that they did for LL Cool J. And, I was just one of the acts. Me, the W.I.S.E Guyz. We had Nikki D and we also had Lady of Rage, and we tried to get all of them signed, but we couldn’t get them on. So, as far as the production deal, (Atlantic was like), “OK, yeah, we like Breeze and we like the W.I.S.E Guyz, but what’s going to solidify the deal, is if the L.A. Posse does an album as well”. So, it was like a three group production deal, if I remember correctly.
Kevin: On “L.A. Posse” you have that line, “Control, I roll over suckers that claim to be/on my tip, they even got the same name as me/All you’re doing is causing confusion…“, was that about someone particular?
Breeze: Yeah, it was. It was two people. It was the dude named The Singing MC Breeze from Philly. And, then there was also another L.A. Posse, but they were from Laurelton, Queens (NY). And, they called themselves the L.A. Posse, so that was kind of a direct shot and indirect shot at the Singing MC Breeze and also (that other) L.A. Posse. But, we kind of shut (the other L.A. Posse) down legally, and basically had them just cease and desist from using the name because we already had a trademark.
Kevin: On the album you have a few lines that seemed to be directed at your record label. At the time, I didn’t know about you being signed to Def Jam so I assumed the lines were about Atlantic, but once I learned more of your story I’ve been wondering, were the lines about Def Jam or Atlantic?
From “T.Y.S.O.N”: “Promotional hype, yeah, that’s why I wrote this/You claim I owe you this, so then promote this/Cut the ‘sation, my talent your wasting/Front on this, man, you must be basin’…”
From “Watch The Hook”: “Excuse the beat, but I refuse to sleep upon/A label selling a dream, yeah right, come on/You couldn’t break the kid, now take a look/while you’re sitting there kickin’ yourself, son, watch the hook!”
Breeze: Well, you know what, it was kind of like a scattershot, it was a little about Def Jam and it was a little about Atlantic. And, it was just because with my years in the business, I kind of started understanding the business and I saw how artists would come out and they would have a big name, they would have all of this, but there was no real push behind them. So, (I felt) if I’m gonna put this out, y’all, make this work. And you know, show me that y’all gonna be just as invested in my project as I am. So, I mean, it was just, you know, just understanding the background of the business. So, it was kind of like an indirect shot at both of them.
Kevin: Looking at the album single choices, where you involved in the those decisions, and looking back, do you feel they were the best choices?
Breeze: Okay, so two things. “L.A. Posse” (the first single), I hated the song from the time that made it. I absolutely hated that song. Matter of fact, I call that the $50 song because when we were making the record, I wasn’t into funk music. Remember, I’m still fresh from New York. I was more James Brown. I wasn’t Parliament. I was James Brown…”Funky Drummer.” So, Muffla started putting that (Funk) on the record, and I started hearing the “Mo’ Bounce” in the back, I was like, “Yo, take that shit off my record. I don’t want that Stop that.” And, he was like, “Naw, just let me finish it” and I was really being disruptive in the studio. So, Muff says, “Hey, look, man, I’ll make you a deal.” And, I said, “What?” He said, “I’m going to give fifty bucks right now just to leave the studio and come back in like two or three hours, and when you come back, if still hate the song, we’ll trash it” I said, “Alright bet. Be prepared to trash this shit it”. Right?
Muffla: OK, (while producing the beat for “L.A. Posse”) Breeze, he was getting on my fucking nerves. He said, “Naw dude, I don’t like that shit” (mocking Breeze whining about it). I said, “Morgan (Breeze’s real name) please, I’ll give you fifty bucks. Just LEAVE and come back. Give me about three hours and if you don’t like it in three hours, I’ll scratch it, you keep fifty, the whole nine. So, it was just me and Steve Ett and we worked on that record. And, when he came back his jaw dropped. (Laughs)
He was trying not to like it. But, he couldn’t help it. But then LL walked in!And LL said, “I want that track.” I’m like, “Well, dude, you can’t have it. This is Breeze’s shit”. (LL) said,”He ain’t gonna do nothing with it. Let me have it.” And, Breeze got a wind of that and said, “Naw man Fuck that. We doing that shit”. He was not about to let LL have that track. LL wanted it bad…He wanted AND Chuck D wanted it! They both wanted that shit. Cuz everybody was in Chung King (Studios) at the same time pretty much. So yeah, that’s what made him actually want that shit because LL wanted it.
Breeze: So, I think I went out to Astoria. I was messing with this chick out in Astoria, so I went out there. And, I came back probably like, four or five hours later. And, then when I walked into the studio, he said, “Are you ready?” I’m like, OK, and he played it. Once he played it, I was like, “Oh shit, OK, yeah, that’s dope. That’s really dope. I really like that song”. So, I had no problem with L.A. Posse after we finished it, but I hated it while we were making it.
Now, “Great Big Freak”, I did not want to do that song by no means. I did NOT want to do it. I actually wanted my second single to be “T.Y.S.O.N”, and what happened was, I don’t know if you remember, but right around the same time, the Fresh Prince put out a song called “I Think I Could Beat Mike Tyson”, and he made a video and all that for the song. But I was like, “Yeah, but I mean my song even though it’s (also called) Tyson, it’s a little bit different, you got to kind of understand what what my “T.Y.S.O.N” is. His is a gimmick thing. Mine is from an MC perspective and an inspirational perspective. But, (Atlantic) was like, “No, Fresh Prince already did it, so we don’t really want to do that. We want to go in a different direction”. And, when they said that they wanted to make the single “Great Big Freak”, I was like, “Yo, that’s the one song I hate that’s on my album.” I think the only reason it was there because it was like the best of the worst songs that we were choosing from at the end of it. So, I did not want to do it. So, for me, that was kind of like the downfall of the relationship between me and Atlantic, to some degree as far as like, “Yo, y’all signed us to do our thing as a production deal. Let us do our thing. If you’re gonna give us an imprint then at least let us make our own choices. But, then that’s when I started to realize that word business is way bigger than music. You know, they handle in the business and they don’t make you do what they want you to do regardless what you think is right, because when it came down to it, even though we had a lot of notoriety, we weren’t that big. I’m saying we weren’t a platinum act, so they kind of like, steered my project into a direction that I really didn’t want to go.
Muffla: Here’s the thing with that Breeze album, Darryl (Big Dad) and I were doing the marketing and the promotion. Back then, you would pay a street team and they’ll take care of you moving up the charts and all that stuff. So, Sylvia wasn’t really putting a lot of effort into the Breeze album. She was putting her effort into the D.O.C album. And, Darryl Musgrove was the head of Urban promotions at Atlantic. And, so me and Darryl paid this (other) guy fifteen Gs (to do our marketing/radio promotions for the Breeze album), and we were moving up the charts. We entered like way at the bottom at like number ninety-something. And, when we got up to #52, Atlantic said we’re gonna take over for here. We were like good. We don’t have to pay this mutha fucka another fifteen Gs.
And as soon, and when I say “as soon”, I mean the following week, we started dropping off the charts. I’m like, What the fuck? You guys, give us our record back, let us go finish (paying this other guy) cause we were climbing. And after that I was like, get the fuck out of here. And, that’s what really opened my eyes about the music industry, if they want you to be a star, you’ll be a star, if they don’t, you won’t, no matter what. So, yeah, that really burnt…I’ll never get that out of my system, that Darryl Musgrove. And, we we’re looking at him like dude, what the fuck is going on, and all he could do is shrug his shoulders, and say “Dude, I’m just doing what I’m told.”
Kevin: I think you had one of the best flows of the time. I’m talking specifically ’88/’89, At that time, some of the leaders of that would be Kane, LL, The D.O.C, Super Lover Cee, and I put you right there in that class of MCs with the best flows of that time…
Breeze: Aw, man. Thank you.
Kevin: So, was perfecting your flow something that was important to you, and how did you see yourself in that regard?
Breeze: Well, yeah…I think… I’ll put it this way, I would have never said for myself that I was in that class. I mean, I’m one of those dudes that like, privately if you talk to me I’d be like, Yo, I never was striving to be the best, that wasn’t my thing. I just wanted to make music that I was happy with, but also, I have a very competitive side. And, my mom even clowns me about this to this to this day, like, even when I was younger, and we would see Mike Tyson boxing, she would be like, “Do you think you can beat Mike Tyson”, and I’d be like, “Yeah, I could”. Like, anything you asked me; I could beat Mike Tyson. I could do everything. I’d beat up Bruce Lee if he was here. I can out-rap anybody that’s around, so I’m one of those dudes that if you put me in front of somebody…then I’m going in! So, as far as those people that you’re speaking on…Kane was definitely a big inspiration in my life as far as being able to just put together dope rhymes and rhythmic patterns. And, even today, I tell people there’s a lot of substance to the stuff that I do say, but you kind of gotta be listening from an MC’s perspective, but I like a lot of flash. I like flash. I like big moves. I like the changeable flow. I like my cadence to be in pocket. I’m more of that kind of person to where I’m like really rhythmic with it, and I always wrote every rhyme like, what if Kane was on this record, what would he say and what would I do to counteract it? If LL was on it, what would I do to counteract it. So, I always wrote as if another MC was on the track with me, so I’m battling myself, but I’m also battling the ghost of the next MC beside me.
Kevin: That’s a dope concept. Building from that. I think for an MC like Kane, his flow was so great that it made some people rate him higher as a writer. I mean, he’s clearly a great writer, but I don’t think he was as great a writer as say Kool G Rap or Rakim (though not far off), but he got put in that same class by many because his flow was so great…one of the best flows ever. But, for you, I feel like there may have been an opposite effect. I feel like your flow was so great that people tended to focus on that and missed out on how great you were as a writer….
Breeze: Well, my whole thing was…I never wanted to be put into a box and just rap one way all the time. So, my goal on every record was kind of like, change the flow a little bit, change the cadence a little bit, do something a little bit different. And, I’m gonna tell you, even though Def Jam overall didn’t pan out to what it should be, it taught me a lot about songwriting. How to stay on task. How to make the end of the song pull together the very start of your song, and how it all flows together and makes one story, and I’m very big on, you know, finishing an idea. Don’t start with one idea, but by the time you get to the end of the song, you’re totally someplace else. It all has to always tie in together.
Kevin: What do you consider the best songs on your “T.Y.S.O.N” album that best showcase you as an MC and/or lyricist?
Breeze: I’ll tell you this, the two best songs that I like as far as cadence wise, and what I felt like show me as an MC…first would be “L.A. Posse” because the way I wrote it. The way I wrote it was, I wrote rhymes inside the rhymes. And what I mean by that is, “It’s time to rhyme, keep it in mind….”, but it ends with, “I’m gifted…with the strength to go the length….and if it”. So, I’m rhyming inside the rhyme, which the punchline doesn’t say nothing about the rhyme that I was rhyming inside. So, I thought the creativity that I used on writing “L.A. Posse” was dope. That was one of the one things I gave myself credit for. And then the other one was “Pull a Fast One” because it just showed that, not only can I rhyme about certain stuff, but I can also go in and blackout even at a high speed as well. So, when it came to those two records…those are the two records where I kind of felt like, “OK, you’re kind of showing off right now”.
Kevin: That in mind, in my research, I noticed that ’89 was the first time I heard MCs rhyme in what eventually was called Double-Time. And, there are three MCs who all do it in ’89. You on “Steadily Tryin’ To Flow Like…”, KRS One on “The Style You Haven’t Done Yet”, and Adrock of the Beastie Boys on “High Plains Drifter” (as well as on “The Sounds of Science”, “Stop The Train”, “Hello Brooklyn”, and “Dropping Names”, making Adrock the first MC I know to really focus on using the style on multiple songs). I’ve been trying to figure what inspired that. Was there a specific reason that you rapped in Double-Time on that song?
Breeze: Wow. Well, you just said it, I was a fan of The Teacher. And ,when he wrote that, that was my attempt of, if I was going to be on a record with KRS what would I say, you know, you gotta come with it! You know what I’m saying? So, that was my ode to KRS. And, I remember one of (the L.A. Posse) played it for Kris. And, Kris was like, “Yo, That’s dope.” And, when I got the validation from him that he thought it was dope, I was like, “OK, I’m on to something.”
Kevin: Do you know the release date for “T.Y.S.O.N” album?
Breeze: I sure don’t. I think it was like June. I think it may be like June or July. It was definitely a summer album, and was out somewhere between June and August. But, if I’m not mistaken, I think (the single/video) “L.A. Posse” came out in May…April or May, and then the album followed two months later, so it had to be either like June or July.
Kevin: Did you do a tour for that album?
Breeze: Yeah, well, I didn’t do my own (headline tour) but I mean, I was on several tours. The ones that I remember the most are, I was on EPMD’s tour. It was me, EPMD…who else…oh…2 Live Crew was on it. I also did the Rhyme Syndicate tour. That was Ice-T, Me, King Tee, Donald D, Spinmasters… We were all on a tour together. Those are like the main two joints that I remember doing off of that album.
Kevin: That’s funny. I remember going to that EPMD and 2 Live Crew show in Chicago, but I didn’t see you perform…were you not on that specific date?
Breeze: No, I wasn’t on that date. And, the crazy thing is back then tour support was not happening. I didn’t really get any tour support from Atlantic. So, I paid my own way on that tour. I paid for transportation…I paid for everything. And, I did maybe about five to seven dates, something like that. But when, you know, when you start running out of money, I’m like, look man, I’m not touring for free. You know what I’m saying. I’m spending up all the money we’re making just to get us to the next city. And, I remember EPMD was cool, but I remember asking one day like, “Yo, we’re kind of short (on money), can you give us a ride to the next city?” And, those niggas were like, “NOPE!”. (Laughs) So, once we couldn’t get a ride…and I don’t know if you know about 2 Live Crew, but Luke had his own operation under strict lockdown. You couldn’t even talk to his dancers. You never even seen them until they came out on stage. They didn’t stay at the same hotels we stayed at. So, I was on the tour with them, but I don’t think I ever met Luke while we were on tour.
Kevin: Do you remember getting in particular support for the record from the main Hip Hop magazines, or even the key radio shows, like Red Alert or Marley Marl? Anything notable stand out??
Breeze: Oh, you know what? The funny thing about it is I didn’t expect no love at all in New York. Hello, the record is “LA, Californ-IA”. I didn’t expect to get NOTHING, but I’m gonna tell you the first time I heard my record…me and Muff, and I think Big Dad, we went to the movies. I think it was on 43rd or 44th…there was a movie theater over there, and forgot what movie we watched. But, I remember as the movie was over, and Red Alert had his (radio) show. I remember having on a Sony Walkman, and going down the escalator to leave the theater and I heard heard my record on New York radio, Red Alert played it as we were coming down the escalator, and I went nuts, I was like, “Yo! They’re playing it! They’re playing it!” There was like four niggas on some headphones trying to listen to it at the same time. I remember that first time I heard it, and I remember, we even spoke to Red and he was like, “Yo, I like that shit, it’s nice (blah, blah blah)”. So, he was like the first New York DJs that ever played my record that I can remember, and also gave me props behind it. And, that was the “L.A. Posse” record.
Kevin: So, one of the things I’ve been trying to figure out is who was the first West Coast artist, and I know you are originally from the East, but who was like the first West Coast artist to get played on the radio or clubs in the East Coast. It’s been a tricky to find that out. I know in 1985, Chuck Chillout played the Ice-T “Killers” instrumental, but he only played the instrumental. Also in 85, Red Alert, played a small part of a Bobby Jimmy record, “Big Butt”, mixing it with Whodini’s “Big Mouth” (which the Bobby Jimmy was a parody of). But, it was just a small portion. I’ve heard rumors that King Tee got a single played in ‘87/’88 (courtesy of DJ Pooh brining them to NY when he came to work on “Bigger And Deffer” with L.A. Posse, and supposedly Jam Master Jay gave them to some DJs), but I haven’t been able to verify who played that or where it was played. So, as of right now, your record is the earliest real confirmation I know of…
Breeze: You know what, I’m going to tell you something, even if that ain’t true, let’s just tell ’em that. (Laughs)
That’s crazy. That’s crazy. I will tell you this though. I remember being on Def Jam, I think I was still on Def Jam it was probably like ‘87-’88 or somewhere around there, when N.W.A was coming out, doing their thing. I remember, I used to champion NWA like, “Yo, yo, y’all need to hear this man.” And, (New Yorkers) would be like, “Man, that’s that West Coast…ain’t nobody trying to hear that…Jheri curl…”. They had a weird impression of L.A., and you know what, coming from New York, that’s what you would have. You would have that impression because that’s all you saw on TV. But, I used to tell people, it’s nothing like you think, that’s just the TV side. That’s not what it’s like when you go around the hood out there. I remember, there was this brother, I think his name was Ant Live or something like that. And, I remember he was the first one that used to be like, “Yo, take that West Coast shit out of there” (Editor’s Note: presumably the tape deck).
Kevin: Looking at the L.A. scene at the time, around the time or not long after your “T.Y.S.O.N” album dropped there was a new movement of MCs on the L.A. Underground, and that was largely built around the The Good Life Cafe. Did you ever go to the Good Life?
Breeze: I want to the Good Life I think once. I think I rapped up there once. But, I mean you know what to be honest at that time I wasn’t kind of like really feeling it that much because, to me it was getting like a little weird. It was just a little different you know. I performed like one time, but really I wasn’t all into that movement because to me it was just a little different. But, then once again, just like anything that’s different, at first you kind of criticize it. But, then after I really got the sciences, and really listened to what those dudes were saying. Then, I was like, “Yo a lot of them dudes can actually really rap!” It was just coming in a different package that I wasn’t used to. Because, you know, remember, rappers out (in L.A.) was kind of like gang banging rappers or you know, drug dealer rappers and the Good Life was kind of like…I don’t want to say like a hippie movement, but it just was different.
BREAKING DOWN EVERY SONG ON THE T.Y.S.O.N ALBUM
T.Y.S.O.N
Breeze: The only thing that I really have about that is “T.Y.S.O.N” was a record that kind of educated me more on Muhammad Ali. And, it’s just real crazy cuz people used to always say, “Yo, how you have a record named Tyson, but it’s Muhammad Ali talking on the breaks”. And, that’s one thing I kept trying to tell people like “Yo, even though it’s (called) T.Y.S.O.N, you have to understand the meaning of (the song titled) T.Y.S.O.N”. And, the meaning of T.Y.S.O.N actually kind of coincided with me being a fan of Mike Tyson, but it’s a bigger story than what you know because (the acronym for) T.Y.S.O.N obviously is The Young Son Of No-one, which back in the day, you know, just like Run was the son of Kurtis Blow, everybody had somebody who bought you out ,who was like your mentor. I really didn’t have no mentors in the game. I did my own thing and you know, I just had people on tapes, and I listened to it and learned that way. And, then the other part of that was, you know, two years before that, me and my Pop’s stopped speaking, so I had no relationship with my father at all. So, actually, it was also a shot at him at the same time.
Muffla: WHOOO! Should have been a single. I loved that…and I should have stayed on that track of those types of beats, the funk. I got away from that because people were in my ear, “You need to make stuff that is more R&B-ish”, and I’m like, “No, that’s not me”. But, people were in my ear, so I got away from the funk. You know that bass, the deep sub-bass, I should have stayed with it.
PULL A FAST ONE
Breeze: Another inspiration behind “Pull A Fast One” was D.O.C because D.O.C used to rap dumb fast. So, I used to be like, “OK, let me see what I can do if I had to do this”. You know, let’s speed it up to 120…118…or whatever that song was. So, that was me feeling D.O.C rap and being like OK, let me see what I could do on that as well.
Kevin: Being that you and The D.O.C were on Atlantic together and had some common connections, did you ever record or cipher together or anything?
Breeze: No, we never rapped together, but you know, I do have one fond memory when we were doing the show together out at that auditorium in Anaheim with the circular stage that spun around. I forgot the name of it. Well, I actually met D.O.C earlier (than that), we had a MTV show that was doing (a special on) Atlantic Records (the label they were both on). It was me, D.O.C, Kwame, MC Lyte…and we did this little thing, and that’s like right around the time my album dropped. And, you know, we kind of developed a little friendship there over 40s and blunts, you know how we do. And, the one memory I have of him besides that was when we did that show (in Anaheim) and I remember asking him, I was like, “Yo, man, I want to be down with N.W.A. I like how y’all get down…”, and I was kind of joking, and I said, “Yo, what do I need to do to get down with N.W.A”, and he looked at me and said (deadpan voice), “Yo, you gotta kill somebody”. I said, “WHAT??!!”. He said, “Yeah, you gotta kill somebody”. I said, “Get the f**k outta here!” (LAUGHS) That was my man though.
Muffla: Okay, this is my memory of “Pull A Fast One”. I had the fucking flu and Darryl, Breeze, his DJ, and (others) were all at the studio. And, me being the technician, you know programming all stuff, they were at a standstill, they couldn’t do shit. So, I got up out the bed with the flu, got on the train and went to Chung King and made that record because they couldn’t do it.
STEADILY TRYING TO FLOW LIKE
Breeze: Like I said that was my ode to KRS. And, that was also my delve into Jazz music. I started liking Jazz music around that time. So, I always wanted to do something a little jazzy as well. Plus, a lot of people don’t know that a lot of the music, like the saxophone playing, and some of the instruments that were played on “Steadily Trying To Flow Like”, those are actually live musicians…people that we knew. So, we were also trying to really incorporate live musicians on the actual records as well.
Muffla: Yeah, that that was an experiment actually. We had met some musicians on the subway that were playing, you know, the guys who play on the subway, on the platform. We had met a couple of guys and brought them in the studio, the drummer and the horn player. And, we pulled them in the studio and we made that record.
And, there was another guy named Billy Patterson. He was actually the guitar player on…what was the name of that show? The cop movie? The cop show back in the day. New York Undercover! Billy Patterson was the guitar player. Remember that club they all used to play music at. There was always a club scene. Billy Patterson was the guitar player on there. And, he was actually instrumental in some of those songs (on the Breeze album).
GOIN’ THRU A PHASE [Produced By DJ Pooh, the only song not produced by L.A. Posse]
Breeze: “Goin’ Through A Phase” was basically, “What am I doing? What am I trying to do? What am I getting out of it? Are you trying to be a MC? You want to be a hardcore rapper? You want to be a ladies man? You want to be…I didn’t know. I’m basically was trying to find myself at that time and define what I was going to be as an artist.
Muffla: DJ Pooh! That was my first time, and to this day I regret this. This was my first time actually paying another producer to do a song. And, I regret to this day that I did not give Pooh more money, and more leeway on that. I regret that to this day because Pooh used to be my favorite producer. I mean, I really, really, really looked up to him. I wanted him to do it…and I was young and dumb. I gave him $5,000. I should have gave him the whole budget for that song. You know what I’m saying, and he would have had more, you know, more room to room to grow with it, and I regret that to this day.
LOUNGIN’
Breeze: We had an apartment in Brooklyn, and we had got this furniture from the West Village. And, it was this furniture that you could kind of flip and turn it different ways and make it from a couch to a bed to a loveseat. And we had two pieces. And the name of furniture was called Slounging or Sloungers or something like that (EDITORS NOTE: I’m not sure about the spelling of that). And, I remember if you would come over the house and if you saw me, I was always on the Slounge. And I’m chilling out, you know, laying back. And, that was also the word of the day, “What you’re doing?”, “I’m just lounging.” So, it was kind of a mix between that was part of the slang and that was the furniture we brought that we was always chillin’ on.
Muffla: My homeboy Tommy Richardson. (Laughs) Actually, him and Darryl tried to make me go the way of R&B, and that (song) was a crossroads of R&B and Hip Hop because you know, I was always a Hip Hop cat. But, R&B was Darryl and Tommy, so they kind of fucked me up on that.
LA POSSE (This was already discussed in detail above, so here’s the music video):
GIRLS ON MY MIND
Breeze: That was kind inspired by the fact that, you know, I used to try to be a player, wanted to be a player or whatever. And, my mom was like always telling me back in the day like, “Yo, I don’t know how you do it, but you always come through here and every girl you bring here is a good girl.” And, the funniest thing is that one of the inspirations behind the song was, my mother has about ten pictures of me and (different) girls that I was messing with. And, the pictures are in the same spot in her house. Every single one of the pictures, you can see I’m in the same spot, but with a different chick, and my mom used to take a picture of us. So, she used to talk mess to me about that, so that was part of how “Girls On My Mind” came about.
Muffla: I like that song. “Girls On My Mind” was Breeze’s whore song. He was a whore back in the day. It was just a fun song, just something to have fun with. We figured you know, we need to cater to your female fan base. You’re a handsome kid, the girls will love you for this. So, you know, that was the theory, but it didn’t work out.
GREAT BIG FREAK
Muffla: Great Big Freak was supposed to be a freak record you know what I’m saying. Yeah, samples, you know, just figuring it out, going through the crates and find some stuff that we like.
SCENE OF THE HOMICIDE
Muffla: Now that was a methodical record. We actually thought that record out, we tried to make it visual, through sound. We tried to make you see…I wanted you to see a murder. I wanted you to see somebody getting shot or killed. We want you to see that through the music and it was an attempt…put it that way. So, it was what it was. It was done on the MPC-60.
Breeze: Well, “Scene of a Homicide” was basically my direct/indirect shot back at LL Cool J because of the tension that we kind of had between each other. And, from what I (heard), and I don’t know how much truth it is, but you know, I believe it’s true because some of my boys told me that when LL supposedly had wrote “Jingling Baby” that one of the verses was about me, when he says, “Can’t believe you tried to grip the same mic as me?/Your grip’s too weak. You can’t hold it B|”. I’m supposed to be “B”, short for Breeze. So, I’m thinking that’s a shot that he’s throwing at me, you know, but at the same time, it wasn’t direct. He really didn’t say my name, (he) said “B”, AND I remember, even Pooh thought he was dissing (him) because (LL) says, No good nincompoop”. But, we thought he said, “no good nigga Pooh, trying to bass”. So, we were just like, “Oh, he’s shooting at both of us, but he calls you out Pooh. He just said ‘B’ about me”. So, it was like, OK, I’m taking a shot back. It was kind of like, I’m not calling you out, but nigga, you know who I’m talking about. So, (on the song) when Muff says, “he had a kangol on…I think my nigga Breeze did that shit”, that was like my indirect shot back at him.
EDITOR’S NOTE: It’s worth nothing that Muffla of L.A. Posse produced the original version of “Jingling Baby”, which was on the “Walking With A Panther” album, before it was remixed by Marley Marl. So, it’s feasible to think Muffla has some insight on whether there is some merit to this theory.
Muffla: LL, when he wrote “Jingling Baby” a part of that was about Breeze, because him and Breeze, when they would come by the house, because LL always came by the house because he didn’t have no friends. So, the niggas from LA was cool with him. So, he comes by the house and him and Breeze would battle every once in a while. Him and Breeze. Him and Nikki D. Nikki D and Breeze, you know they would all battle. I think the lyrics were, “your grips to weak, you can’t hold it B!”, so yeah, that was about Breeze.
And, do you remember Bill? Bill Adler, one day we were at Def Jam. Me and Darryl (Big Dad), we always hung out at Def Jam when we had no studio time. We’re just learning you know, sucking everybody’s brains, you know, getting information from Heidi and everybody. And, one day Breeze comes in, and we’re talking, and we’re talking about him, you know, working on his album and all this shit and I forget how the conversation went, but Breeze says… Now mind you, Bill always stayed at his desk. He was always working. He always had his head down. He was always talking to somebody or writing something. And, Breeze said. “You know what? My album’s gonna be dope! Oh, it’s gonna be better than LL!” And, the LOOK on Bill Adler’s face, he raised his head REAL slow and looked at him like, “Mutha Fucka! You will NEVER be as def as LL!” (Laughs) Kevin, the look on his face, I mean like the way I’m saying it, that’s how he looked! Oh. My. God. You talk about falling on the ground laughing. It was comical.
“Watch The Hook”
Breeze: ”Watch The Hook” that was like one of those on the whim records we did just messing around doing some stuff, and it was still in the T.Y.S.O.N phase, so there’s like a boxing reference. But, also at the same time, it was watch the hook as far as the hook because remember right before (right), even right (when my album was out) hooks were real simple. The name of your song, you would just repeat it. If (your song) was called “My Dope Car”, the hook would be something like (mockingly), “I’m driving around in my dope car, my dope car…I think I gotta dope car” I just wanted to do something that really focused on a hook that did something different besides just chant a hook. You know what I mean?
Muffla: (Muffla gets super excited) OHHHHH “Watch The Hook”! “Watch The Hook” was supposed to be, we were finishing up the album. He really didn’t have anything that had any energy. So, that was the thing for that one.
I actually had fun doing that too. I did all the scratches and shit on that too.
AFTER THE YOUNG SON OF NO ONE ALBUM
Kevin: So, after “The Young Son Of No One” were you working on a second album, or what were your next steps?
Breeze: Well, you know what, I actually…you know, it’s crazy because actually (Atlantic) did have another album planned for me to do. But, you know, at that point, I was kind of like, (the label’s) relationship with me kind of had soured because of me not understanding the business and I never had a manager my whole career. I didn’t have no management. So, I didn’t really have nobody to guide me on the right direction. Big Dad attempted to do it a little bit, but you know, he was still busy with L.A. Posse and producing with Muffla, and doing all this other stuff that they were doing, so he couldn’t really devote the time to me that he needed to. And, on top of that, realistically I don’t think that would have been his speciality around that time anyway. So, I kind of like never had a management, so when shit didn’t go like I expected it to go, I mean even though I had some cool successes, I just thought it should have been a lot bigger. And, I just saw like a lot of stuff that was going on around me and how you know, Kwame was kind of blowing up a little bit. D.O.C was out the water, and he was out the water because everybody up in Atlantic was scared of N.W.A. They really thought that N.W.A would really come up there and shoot their offices up. They really thought that and I’m like looking at these niggas laughing like, Oh, really? Is that what y’all think? Crazy enough, one day I got a bottle of something and got drunk, put on a khaki suit and I went up to Atlantic. And, I think I cursed out three niggas in a row, like I went from office to office to office. And, Sylvia Rhone called me like, “Yo, Breeze what is wrong with you? That so doesn’t seem like you. What’s going on?” And, I just told her that I was not thrilled with the way I thought my project was being handled. At that time, I did start recording other music, but I was being courted by other record labels. Motown being one of them. Capital One was another one. Then, on top of that, you got to understand that, even though I’m part of L.A. Posse as a crew, I wasn’t L.A. Posse in terms of the production team. And, so I was really under a production deal. And, if you know anything about the music (industry), artists under a production deal, (the earnings are the producer’s money) and they’re piecing you off of their money. So, my points came from their points basically. So, you know, I was just feeling I needed to do my own thing, not that I was going to leave L.A. Posse because they were always gonna produce my music, but I just wanted a different situation, to where Breeze is signed to the label and Breeze gets…well, if you got 10–12 points back in those days, you were doing great. So you know, I wanted my own 10–12 points. So, I attempted to jump ship, and I remember vividly I had a deal on the table, and (Jheryl Busby) said, “Look man, I can’t tell you straight up that I’m going to sign you cause you are under another label. But, I will tell you this, if you weren’t tied to another label, I’m sure any label would love to have you.” I had a meeting with Jheryl Busby and he was running Motown at the time. And, Jonathan Clark brought me and Jonathon broke the Good Girls and you know, stuff like that. So, when he gave me that cue…and matter of fact, his son Chris Busby used to run clubs out here, and Chris Busby used to hook me up on a lot of shows and stuff like that. So, I was like, OK, I got this shit signed, sealed, and delivered. After that. I was about to get myself out my deal. And once again, no management, no guidance. And, I didn’t realize the ramifications of what may happen after that, and I actually didn’t realize how powerful Sylvia Rhone was at the time. So, you know, I remember making a call into Atlantic and I was like, “Yo, can I speak to Sylvia, this is Breeze”. Soon as Sylvia gets on the phone, her first words are, “Hey Breeze baby, you ready to do your next album?” And I said, “No, I’m actually calling you because I’m looking for a release from the album. I don’t want to do this no more.” And she said, “What??”. And I’m like, “Yeah, I’m done. I don’t want it. I think I’m going to quit rapping. I don’t even really want to rap no more. I’m not even, you know, thrilled by this shit no more. Rapping is just something that I can do. That’s not who I am.” And she said to me, I remember vividly, she said, “Do you know what you’re saying?!” I said, “Yeah, I know exactly what I’m saying”. She said, “Are you sure about what you are saying right now”. I said, “Yeah, I’m dead serious”. She signed my release in less than a month, and got me out my contract in less than a month. Now, once I got my release, I was going back to Jonathan Clark because he was quarterbacking my deal to go on to Motown. But, Jonathan Clark ass gets fired because there’s some scandal behind him and The Good Girls. So, now my deal with Motown, my whole connection, everything kind of just goes down the toilet. So now I don’t got a deal there, so now I’m about to go over to Capitol. And, now this is right when around 92 when I had my own label, Hollywood and Vine Records, and I put out “It Ain’t Funky No Mo” and “Black Owned” 12". And, I remember going over there, and all the executives were like, “Yeah, we’re going to sign you Breeze.” And I remember it was the meeting before I was going to get my paperwork, and I don’t remember if it happened while I was there or when I left, but somebody said, “Naw, we’re not gonna be able to sign you now”. And I’m like, “WHY??”. He said, “Well, we heard that you came up here and cursed out our secretary.” I said, “That’s a lie. I like y’all secretary…I’m trying to get at her…I never cursed her out”. So, long story short, the story started to come out years later, and I started to find out, you know, I think old girl (Sylvia Rhone) put the screws on me and basically was like, “Look, I’ll let them go off this label, but nobody can fuck with him.” And that’s when it came out that I was kind of like blackballed from the industry because I would have deals on the table, and then miraculously they would just disappear and labels would just tell me, we can’t fuck with you. And I remember being at a club one day and John Salley, the basketball player, I was at a club and John Salley was there and I was like, “What up John”, and he was like “What up Breeze?” I was like, “Damn, you know me”, and he was like, “Yeah, I know a lot about you. I know your ass got blackballed in this business too”, and I looked at him and I’m like, “Are you serious??!!” And, he was like, “You didn’t know?” And, I was like, “I guess I do now”. So, that’s when I really start to think, maybe there is some real truth to this story (about Sylvia Rhone black-balling me).
Muffla: We thought it was a pretty good album (“The Young Son Of No One”). You know it really had that one hit on it, the “LA posse” joint. And, as far as him touring, Darryl was an inexperienced manager. So, if you notice, some of the decisions that were made on Breeze’s career were not good decisions. Like when you got a hot record, Breeze got the big head and Darryl, you know, I don’t think he guided him right on that because if you notice, you remember “We’re All In The Same Gang”? Breeze wasn’t on it…why? Breeze was not it because Breeze had (the idea that) I don’t need to be on that, my record is hot right now. That was some shit that he should have been on. But, then there was tour. It was it was supposed to be Breeze, EPMD…I think it was Easy E. It was a few West Coast guys that were on that tour, and Breeze lasted maybe three days and felt that he should have his own tour. That he should be headlining it. Dude, you got one fucking record! Shut the fuck up! (Laughs)
But, you know you live in you learn and he learned a lot from that. You know, he also learned that you don’t bite the hand that feeds you because, I don’t know if they told you about this one how Breeze got blackballed? He told Sylvia he didn’t want to be on the label. Dude, you don’t get out your deal before you get a deal! (Laughs) So, Kevin Woodley wanted to sign Breeze to, I think was CBS back then, and one day it was, “We’re going to sign you…”, and the very next day, “I can’t sign you dude”.
He burned Sylvia, and Sylvia got on the horn and said, “You better not sign that mutha fucka!” (Editor’s Note: This is likely Muffla’s interpretation of the situation with his natural dramatic effect, rather than a suggested direct quote of Sylvia Rhone)
So, nobody would touch him. That’s why we started Hollywood and Vine Records, and did that song called “Black Balled” (Editor’s Note: There is not a song called “Black Balled” on the Hollywood and Vine 12", so I’m assuming he means the song “Block Owned”, I didn’t catch that during the interview to verify).
Kevin: Is there a reason you haven’t made your music available yet, especially digitally. I imagine there might be some more complications with the Atlantic Record, but what about the three songs you put out independently on your own label, Hollywood and Vine?
Breeze: Actually, you know like I said, I was gone for a little while, and that’s one thing that I’m getting ready to try and do right now. Is try to make whatever music that I can available. But, I ain’t gonna lie, I’m just learning to do all of that (digital distribution, etc…). But, I’m about to take this digital marketing class and learn how to do this new shit because I’m not hip on how it all works. And, I’m also kind of lightweight tight about how come I can’t find any of music I did on Spotify. The only thing that I can find on there is the shit I did with King Tee.
Kevin: Did you ever write for other artists?
Breeze: I wrote for some artists. Nothing that I would really go into any details and say anything about, but I wrote a lot of stuff for a lot of people. I wrote some shit for King Tee. But, I’m not one of those people, if (they aren’t) going to put out there, I’m not going to blow their cover, just read the credits you’ll see it.
Kevin: Can you tell me what you wrote for King Tee?
Breeze: I really can’t because it’s been so much that you know, put it this way, I’ve never wrote a whole song for him. Never. I never wrote a whole song, but I’m always there like, you know, like even on some of the songs we were on together, I helped him out with a few bars. I may have wrote maybe a verse for this song here or another song here when he was doing that project on Aftermath. I had a lot of writing on that. I was hoping to God that shit came out because I was going to get a nice little publishing run off of that. So, that would have been a good look if that project would have came out.
Kevin: We’ve talked about a lot of your unreleased music in this interview. Do you have a lot of that stuff still??
Breeze: NO! no, no, no. I’m so hot. You know what, I think if I went and searched I may be able to find some stuff. You know, I think Muffla has about twenty songs. So, he got a few of them. But that’s one thing that I regret, that I don’t have a catalog of all the stuff that I’ve done over the years because you know what, I would love to play some of it now just, you know, listen to it, because man, it was a lot of stuff that we did, a lot of firsts that we did while we were on Def Jam. Doing shit that people wasn’t even trying and that’s how my name got a little bit known and that’s how L.A. Posse kind of started their venture into producing for everybody else off the work that we did.
