Taking your show to the big screen: Kim Yau on Hollywood podcast adaptations

As fiction podcasts continue to grow in popularity and Hollywood turns its attention to this burgeoning pool of content, intellectual property and derivative rights are increasingly valuable to creators.

Acast’s Grace Ross, US Content Development Manager, sat down with Kim Yau, Literary Manager at Echo Lake Entertainment, to talk about scripted podcasts and the possibilities in the TV and film market.

This conversation has been condensed and edited from the original video recording, published on Acast’s YouTube Channel. This piece was made as part of Acast’s Audio Fiction Week. You can find out more about Audio Fiction Week at acast.com/audiofictionweek, or via #AcastAudioFictionWeek on social.

Grace Ross: What have you been working on in the podcast space when it comes to film and TV?

Kim Yau: I’ve worked my entire Hollywood career selling film and TV rights to all kinds of IP — books, graphic novels, podcasts, of course. Archive 81 and the adaptation to come on Netflix is one that we’re really excited about overall, and I’ve been working with the Wolf 359 creators and other podcast creators as well.

It’s a good time in film and television to be having conversations about podcasts, now that more adaptations are coming out.

GR: What’s working in Hollywood right now when it comes to podcast adaptations?

KY: Genre works really well for adaptations. The one caveat is genre adaptations that could be too expensive, like a crazy space opera on a fantasy planet. Taken together, that would be a little bit of an extra consideration for film and TV.

When it comes down to it, it’s about having a good hook for what the series or film could be, and compelling characters. Regardless of genre, that’s going to be the most important always, and that’s something I would encourage all creators to continue to focus on.

GR: What are some of the ways you work with your clients when you’re thinking about an adaptation, especially given that some scripted podcasts contain many seasons, and sometimes upwards of 60 episodes?

KY: First, it’s most important to identify at what point the series or film adaptation starts to come together in your mind from listening to the podcast. The framework of a podcast when you’re talking about audio-fiction is about slow reveals, where each layer gets you continually listening for the next episode to figure out the next piece of the puzzle. For television, it’s actually diametrically opposite. You need to know upfront and very quickly where the series is headed and have a sense of what’s to come, even if you don’t have the full picture.

What I find really helpful when speaking with podcast creators in the scripted audio space is how much does someone need to listen to — in terms of episodes — to understand what the vision will be for film and TV. It varies from podcast to podcast. For some, it’s listening to the first few episodes; for others, to the first season. Having an understanding of that point is very key, I’d say.

After, it’s about finding people in the film and TV space who gravitate to the kind of story that’s being told, be it by genre or by what’s happening in the plot overall, which comes back to the compelling characters argument. You want to create characters that your audience will emotionally resonate with, because — whether it’s audio-fiction, or film, or TV — that’s what keeps us watching and listening.

GR: What recommendations would you give to an independent creator for how they should start to think about a television adaptation and approaching Hollywood agents?

KY: It’s figuring out a way, especially if you have a long running series, of conveying what the heart of the story is going to be. It doesn’t have to be a performative pitch. If anything, it shouldn’t be — because a representative will be interested in what’s key and fundamental to the story itself.

One thing I would advise for creators is the question, what is the engine of the potential series for television? Even with successful limited series, you want it to come back, and that’s the hallmark of a great series. So, it doesn’t have to be so derivative as saying, “well, the engine is, it’s a detective of the week show”. There can be more nuance, but you want to have a sense of what’s driving the plot forward and creating opportunities for more plot overall.

GR: What can a podcaster expect once they’ve found an agent?

KY: It starts with figuring out a plan, and ideally that right representative for you will have a plan laid out. Then, usually, it’s sharing with producers in the film and TV space — possibly looping in a writer in the film and TV space, as well. But it really depends context to context and project to project.

Those conversations will lead to creating a pitch, bringing it to buyers and studios, and then going from there. It’s a process where you continually bring in additional elements as you continue down the pathway. Everyone has a very variable length for how long that process takes, and that’s the up and down road of Hollywood which is so crazy. But, when you can get to the finish line, it’s all worth it.

GR: Do you have any advice for scripted creators when it comes to IP?

KY: I’d say first, when you’re translating mediums between podcasts and TV, inevitably expect there are going to be creative changes. You’re always going to have the story as you told it and the way that you see it in your heart and your mind in the podcast. But it might look a little bit different in its different forms for television and film, so just be prepared for that.

Second, if you can, hold onto the film and TV rights. I say ‘if you can’, because more and more people are asking for the film and TV rights overall.

And the third thing I would mention is, just keep creating. Whether it’s your first podcast or the 10th podcast you’ve created, keep putting stories out there. I think the best thing for the community is for there to be a wealth of stories, so other podcasters realize what they can do as well.

Inevitably, film and TV will have more podcast adaptations, but there really needs to be a strong well to draw from and reference points of successful podcasts in the past that have gone through that pathway. The act of creation will lead us to that point where we see more and more on screen, and that’ll be exciting. If we don’t create those opportunities and that content isn’t created, we’re not necessarily going to get there as fast.

Acast would like to thank Kim for taking the time to chat. You can find out more about Echo Lake Entertainment at http://www.echolakeentertainment.com, and don’t forget to shout out your favorite fiction podcasts on social using #AcastAudioFictionWeek.