Creating a Culture of Courage: R Karl Hebenstreit Of Perform & Function On How to Create a Culture Where People Feel Safe to be Authentic & Why That Helps the Bottom Line

An Interview With Vanessa Ogle

Work on changing mindset from the solipsistic Golden Rule, where we expect others to want and like the same things we do, to the more inclusive Platinum Rule, where we treat people the way THEY want to be treated, to the more integrative Rhodium Rule, where differences are incorporated into and expanding of our existing mindsets. Using the Enneagram can really help make this happen, when leaders, teams, and organizations are open and ready to do so. This is the foundation for enabling people to be their courageous, authentic selves, without fear of reprisal.

In today’s fast-paced world, authenticity in the workplace and in our personal lives has become more crucial than ever. Yet, fostering an environment where individuals feel secure enough to express their true selves remains a challenge. The importance of authenticity cannot be overstated — it is the foundation of trust, innovation, and strong relationships. However, creating such a culture requires intention, understanding, and actionable strategies. As part of this series, we had the pleasure of interviewing R. Karl Hebenstreit, Ph.D., PCC.

Karl’s 25+ year career spans the areas of Organization Development, Leadership Development, Workforce Development, Employee Relations and Communications, Recruitment and Staffing, Training & Development, Compensation & Benefits, and Career Management / Outplacement in the biotechnology, clinical diagnostics, life sciences, healthcare, pharmaceutical, telecommunications, professional services, high-tech, and real estate services industries. He has worked at Merck, Bellcore, AT&T, Lee Hecht Harrison, Cushman & Wakefield, Kaiser Permanente, EMC², Bio-Rad Laboratories, and Genentech/Roche. He is a regular speaker at Enneagram and Organization Development Conferences around the world, as well as for corporate clients and even cruise ships!

He holds a Ph.D. in Organizational Psychology from the California School of Professional Psychology, a MS in Human Resource Management from the Rutgers Graduate School of Management and Labor Relations, and a BA in Psychology, French, and Political Science from Rutgers College. Karl received his executive coaching training through Fielding Graduate University, focusing on the International Coach Federation’s core competencies and an evidence-based approach. He is an accredited Enneagram Teacher, an IEA Accredited Professional with Distinction, and is also certified in the Myers-Briggs Type Instrument (MBTI). Other certifications include PHR (through SHRM/HRCI), PCC (through ICF), Hogan, Situational Leadership II (through the Ken Blanchard Companies), Leadership Circle Profile (through the Full Circle Group), Leadership Architect, VOICES, and TEAM Architect (through Lominger), and is a Certified Scrum Master and Agile Coach. Karl is the author of The How and Why: Taking Care of Business with the Enneagram (now in its third edition) and Nina and the Really, Really Tough Decision (available in English, Spanish, Greek, and French).

Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series. Before we dive into our discussion our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you share with us the backstory about what brought you to your specific career path?

It’s my pleasure! Thank you for the opportunity!

Despite my initial focus on French and Political Science as my undergraduate majors at Ruthers College, I realized my passion for Psychology when I took some elective courses in this area, culminating in my discovery of what was then called “Industrial and Personnel Psychology.” That led me to adding Psychology to my areas of study, and eventually graduating with a triple major. I knew I wanted a career in Human Resources, fulfilling the personal mission I had identified as a child: to make people happy. I have since amended and operationalized that to be more about helping people fulfill their potential at work, where they spend most of their lives, through a better understanding of themselves and others. A MS in HR Management followed this, while I worked as a full-time temporary employee in Human Resources roles during the day and took graduate courses in the evening. This practical work experience and graduate degree helped me land my first and next full-time, benefitted roles in the Human Resources departments of myriad organizations in diverse industries. Being motivated by continuous improvement and development, I pursued a Ph.D. in Organizational Psychology from the California School of Professional Psychology/Alliant International University, allowing me to focus more on leadership and organization development. That journey introduced me to the Enneagram, an incredible, robust system of human motivation, which I experimented with and used in my various roles, led to me writing my business book (The How and Why: Taking Care of Business with the Enneagram) and my children’s book (Nina and the Really, Really Tough Decision) and to eventually becoming a solopreneur (www.performandfunction.com) in 2022 … and here we are!

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you started your career?

The short story: In retrospect, it seems like I had always been destined to become an entrepreneur, even though this didn’t come to full fruition until 2022.

The deets: I never set out to become a speaker, author, or entrepreneur. A series of fortuitous events all lined up for me to naturally evolve into these areas. I was fortunate to find the International Enneagram Association in the early 2000s and become exposed to the many facets of the Enneagram and its use in myriad ways by many passionate, professional people. I noticed that the business aspect was at its very beginnings and was really interested in contributing to that underserved area, so I submitted proposals (and was thrilled to be accepted) to be a speaker at future conferences, in the US and around the world! At one conference in Canada, after I delivered my workshop, I received the pivotal question, “When is the book coming out?” I must have looked like a deer-in-headlights, because I had never thought of writing a book about my uses of the Enneagram in organizations. I considered the idea and realized it wasn’t that far-fetched — I already had my dissertation that could serve as a chapter. And each of my Enneagram-based organization development interventions I was already using in the companies I worked could be a chapter of its own. And voila! I self-published my first business book in 2016, resulting in its being the number one best-seller at follow-up Enneagram conferences worldwide, and now is in its third edition! The company I had initially set up in 2001, using the generous severance package and reimbursement plan that AT&T provided me in my first (of what would eventually be five over the course of my 30-year career!) layoffs, the entrepreneurial spirit instilled in me by father (who started his own business after his own layoff), and my serendipitous introduction to the Enneagram in my graduate studies all came together as a series of fortunate and organically-developing events and mindsets that led me to be the entrepreneur I am today, living out my mission to help people be happier by achieving their ultimate potential.

You are a successful individual. Which three character traits do you think were most instrumental to your success? Can you please share a story or example for each?

1. Openness to new opportunities, especially in times of potential adversity. This includes going the non-traditional route of crafting my own 2-year long temporary employee rotation program in Human Resources in a major pharmaceutical company (after not being able to secure a more “permanent” situation during a bad economy), moving cross-country to take on a new job in a state where I had no friends, family, or support network, changing jobs when it was clear that the entirety of what I brought to the table was not being appreciated (even when a new job wasn’t yet secured), and launching my own solopreneurship (when certain elements of my identity became less attractive to potential employers).
2. Continuous learning. Being open to learning and growing, challenging my existing mindset, exposing myself to new tools and frameworks, immersing myself in new environments and learning from them, have all been instrumental to my success. PLUS, the people I have met in these same journeys have contributed to point 3.
3. Relationship-Building, Nurturing, and Networking. It’s not about what you know, it’s also about WHO you know. The people I’ve had the good fortune of meeting, working with, and learning from over the course of my career have all become a treasured part of my vast network. There is mutual respect and willingness to help each other as much as possible. As an entrepreneur, I have come to find that all of my work can in some way be attributable to my network. And it goes both ways. I receive work or referrals from them and I refer work to them as well. I have been more successful in engaging in projects from them (as they reach out to me based on their knowledge of my experience and reputation) than from people who don’t know me.

Ok, thank you for that. Let’s now jump to the primary focus of our interview. Can you share a pivotal moment in your career or personal life when being authentic made a significant impact on your success or well-being?

Coming out as gay was definitely a step into embracing my authenticity. Growing up in Greece in the 1970s, I had no gay role models (shout out to Greece for just legalizing same-sex marriage!). Even when my parents and I moved back to the US in the 1980s to fairly liberal New Jersey, this was not the case. In my teens, I remember winning a local contest where the prize was a selection of books. One of the books I picked was “The Corporate Closet” which, for me, was my first foray into being gay from the safety of a “business book.” It validated and legitimized being gay in corporate settings, and advocated for being your true self, warning about the dangers and weight of constantly code shifting, and the emotional and intellectual drain of constantly having to think about how to show up to prevent discrimination and being “othered.” I have definitely experienced discrimination and prejudice in the workforce due to being gay and have learned from these experiences that these are environments I don’t want to be in; no one should have to be in them. This was one of the reasons that drew me to relocate to California, where I felt I could be my authentic self and be accepted and celebrated for who I am, rather than have to hide it and live in fear of discrimination or even worse. And this has been a lesson of which I remind myself — whenever you’re in a situation (this applies to work and relationships, by the way) where you are not valued for the entirety of what you bring (and oftentimes penalized for being and doing so), leave. Find somewhere where your total self is not only accepted, but also — and more importantly — invited and celebrated. This is all about readiness — your readiness to see your own worth, your readiness to see others’ worth, and finding a tribe (organization, association, affinity group, social group) that is ready to see that as well.

What strategies have you found most effective in fostering an environment where employees or team members feel safe to express their true selves, including their ideas, concerns, and aspirations?

Creating an environment and culture of psychological safety, where diverse opinions and perspectives are not just tolerated, but sought out, understood, and acted upon is the basis for what you are describing. And it involves the conscious debunking of the Golden Rule and adoption of the Platinum and Rhodium rules, instead. There are so many obstacles to be overcome, including long-standing implicit biases against “others.” First off, we must all work to eradicate the “Golden Rule” mindset prevalent in society today — and propagated through churches, religion, influencers, and even hotel advertisements that keep touting “Treat others the way you want to be treated.” Guess what? Not everyone is the same, has the same background, ideologies, belief systems, likes/dislikes/preferences, values, orientations, levels of ability, etc. to warrant the same treatment. The Golden Rule is selfish and self-serving and implies that everyone is the same; we know that’s not true. If that were the case, there’d be no conflict and no wars. Adopting the Platinum Rule as a mindset and way of being is far more inclusive and can lead to a broadening of perspective and understanding: “Treat others the way THEY want to be treated.” This involves relationship-building, care, and empathy — and will result in increasing one’s Emotional Intelligence in the process. Take it a step further to the Rhodium Rule and integrate the learnings from these new and differing perspectives into our own, to further broaden our horizons and understanding of the world, have better relationships, and make better decisions.

Other strategies can build off of these new mindsets:

• Increasing awareness of our implicit biases, and actively and consciously working to reduce and eradicate them and microaggressions that have become so commonplace and acceptable in the workplace and in society. Not interrupting others or cutting them off when they are speaking. Giving credit appropriately when someone else says the same thing louder. Ensuring everyone who wants to speak has the chance to do so and be heard, acknowledged, and is given the equal chance to have their input acted upon, as appropriate.
• Provide opportunities for further follow-up from those who may need more processing time.
• Providing as much information up front as possible so people can feel and come prepared.
• Holding meaningful 1:1s where managers really learn what’s important to each of their team members, what challenges they are facing, and what their true aspirations are. Development and succession plans would finally be meaningful!
• Role modeling and showcasing diversity and inclusion at all levels of the organization. Showcasing and rewarding incidents where healthy challenges to the status quo and conventional thinking resulted in a better product, decision, innovation, or result. Rewarding well-intentioned failures as learning opportunities and conducting “lessons learned” reviews that are collected and studied for future use.

How do you navigate the challenges that come with encouraging authenticity in a diverse workplace, where different backgrounds and perspectives may sometimes lead to conflict?

As an Executive Coach and Organization Development Consultant, I am often sought out to help in these types of situations. I find the Enneagram to be a very effective tool in helping people better understand themselves and each other, and advocate for this to be used for team-building to minimize the chance for unproductive and unhealthy conflict (because productive and healthy conflict also exists and is necessary for innovation and high performance). I have seen incredible turnarounds when people sit down together with an objective third party (coach) who leads them through a discussion of understanding each other’s different perspectives and ways of thinking, acting, and feeling, addressing their core motivations, fears, and pet peeves, as well as the common goal towards which they are working. The Enneagram is such a great way to normalize this, showcasing how each diverse driver has strengths to be leveraged as well as blindspots to be addressed and looked out for.

Based on your experience and research, can you please share “5 Ways to Create a Culture Where People Feel Safe to be Authentic?”

1. Work on changing mindset from the solipsistic Golden Rule, where we expect others to want and like the same things we do, to the more inclusive Platinum Rule, where we treat people the way THEY want to be treated, to the more integrative Rhodium Rule, where differences are incorporated into and expanding of our existing mindsets. Using the Enneagram can really help make this happen, when leaders, teams, and organizations are open and ready to do so. This is the foundation for enabling people to be their courageous, authentic selves, without fear of reprisal.

2. Putting foundational systems in place that support and encourage all aspects of diversity — recruitment, medical, benefits, compensation, time off plans — especially those not already federally- or locally-mandated. For example, make generic floating holidays available so people can take time off according to their own personal religious and spiritual belief systems, or lack thereof. Have cafeteria benefits plans that cover a wide range of options and coverages (including adoption, in vitro fertilization, gender reassignment surgery coverage, pet insurance, etc.). Offer paternity leave in addition to maternity leave. Be creative with time off plans — if budgets are tight for increases, offer more time off or sabbaticals instead to those who’d rather have that than a raise. Remote working options. This is a highly-visible way to show people they can be their authentic selves and that the organization supports this.

3. Clarity and transparency. Even though some people like surprises, no one wants to be surprised when it comes to their employment and livelihood. Organization satisfaction and engagement surveys consistently report lack of communication as the number one employee complaint. This leads to lack of trust and disengagement, especially when nothing is perceived to be done about this year after year, with the same results. If leadership isn’t seen as being fully transparent, what are they hiding? And when employees are surprised with negative feedback about their performance at the end of the year, they question why they weren’t given better guidance, direction, and feedback along the way. Full transparency, including open and regular 2-way communication from leadership and in 1:1s with managers, a clear vision, mission, and values, clarity around performance expectations, and guidelines for the manager-employee relationship, including how/when to give feedback both ways is critical to ensure that employees bring their authentic selves to work, in service of the organization’s mission and vision, and that they can courageously speak up when necessary, without fear of negative consequences.

4. Explicit focus on and work to ensure that when diverse perspectives are finally at the table, they are actually, actively, and genuinely sought out, listened to, and acted upon, as appropriate. Once diverse perspectives have been attracted to an organization, the work continues to ensure that these voices feel comfortable and invited to speak, be heard, and have their great ideas implemented accordingly. There is nothing more frustrating than joining an organization that claims to be embracing diversity and valuing each employee’s authenticity, and actually experiencing the opposite — where people aren’t heard, and that those with the courage to express differing opinions or perspectives are punished and ostracized. These stories, or organizational fables, become legendary, and are passed on through the corporate grapevine for decades to come, even if they’re one-offs.

5. Optics: where people can see others who look like them, especially at all levels, including leadership. Look up an organization’s website and check out the “About” section. How diverse does the leadership team look? How about the Board of Directors? How welcome do you think that potential candidates and employees would feel if they don’t see themselves represented in that mix? What if they aspire to a leadership role? Would this make them want to work there? How comfortable would they be bringing their true, authentic self to work for this organization? How accepted would they feel from the very beginning? On the flip side, how much safer and more courageous would they feel to be their authentic selves if they saw themselves and/or their story in any of these pictures or biographies?

In your opinion, how does authenticity within an organization influence its relationship with customers, clients, or the broader community?

It couldn’t be a simpler formula: Authenticity and vulnerability build trust. And trust is the foundation of effective relationships. People want to know who we really are in order to trust us. We can all tell when someone seems disingenuous, is putting on a façade, or that they’re hiding something; our guard is raised because we don’t want to be hurt, fooled, or taken advantage of. Authenticity allows us to know someone, build trust with them, and have better, more sustainable relationships with them. If something feels off, we courageously ask them rather than assuming the worst, if we already have doubts about their sincerity, genuineness, or authenticity. The greater openness and inclusivity generated from authenticity helps organizations better understand their people, their stakeholders, and their customers and their individual needs — and how to better address them. Any missteps are more easily corrected, sooner, and with greater forgiveness. And better products are designed to meet the needs of diverse customer bases based on the greater inclusion of diverse ideas of employees. All of this leads to better fiscal performance as well. McKinsey reports that organizations with more culturally- and ethnically-diverse boards of directors are 43% more likely to have higher profitability. Also, diverse organizations are 35% more likely to have financial returns higher than their industry median and earn 2.5 times more cash flow per employee.

You are a person of great influence. If you could start a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. :-)

I know it may sound cheesy, but my personal mission and life’s goal is to try to make peoples’ lives easier and happier. I’m focusing my work on businesses, where people spend most of their lives and where I can have a broader impact on teams and organizations. And I truly believe that if people become more self-aware, empathetic to different perspectives and experiences, learn about the Enneagram and ultimately make the world a better place, we could ostensibly achieve that seemingly-elusive world peace that politicians, spiritual leaders, and beauty pageant contestants keep talking about. It is possible. Come join the journey and help achieve this vision!

How can our readers further follow you online?

Connect with me on LinkedIn at www.linkedin.com/in/rkarlhebenstreit and feel free to check out more about me, my books, and services at www.performandfunction.com !

Thank you for the time you spent sharing these fantastic insights. We wish you only continued success in your great work!

Thank YOU for the opportunity to share my thoughts and vision with you and your community!

About The Interviewer: Vanessa Ogle is a mom, entrepreneur, inventor, writer, and singer/songwriter. Vanessa’s talent in building world-class leadership teams focused on diversity, a culture of service, and innovation through inclusion allowed her to be one of the most acclaimed Latina CEO’s in the last 30 years. She collaborated with the world’s leading technology and content companies such as Netflix, Amazon, HBO, and Broadcom to bring innovative solutions to travelers and hotels around the world. Vanessa is the lead inventor on 120+ U.S. Patents. Accolades include: FAST 100, Entrepreneur 360 Best Companies, Inc. 500 and then another six times on the Inc. 5000. Vanessa was personally honored with Inc. 100 Female Founder’s Award, Ernst and Young’s Entrepreneur of the Year Award, and Enterprising Women of the Year among others. Vanessa now spends her time sharing stories to inspire and give hope through articles, speaking engagements and music. In her spare time she writes and plays music in the Amazon best selling new band HigherHill, teaches surfing clinics, trains dogs, and cheers on her children.

Please connect with Vanessa here on linkedin and subscribe to her newsletter Unplugged as well as follow her on Substack, Instagram, Facebook, and X and of course on her website VanessaOgle.