Dr. Alice Rizzi of Together Mindful On How To Listen Effectively To Succeed Personally And Professionally
An Interview With Doug Noll
Increased Other-Awareness — You get to learn a great deal about other people when you listen effectively. You’d be surprised at all the deep, dark secrets people are willing to share when they feel heard. Used for good, this means you can support them in the way they need, offer assistance, and be the best problem-solver they’ve ever had. Kind of like anticipating their needs in exactly the way they want — sometimes they won’t even remember they told you this but just appreciate your effort. Imagine how popular that might make you at work, school, or among your family and friends?
It’s hard to be a good listener. We are programmed to want to talk, and to share. It takes effort to stop and to listen. But anyone who has achieved great success will tell you that listening is such an important quality to have. What are some ways that influential people have learned to listen, to succeed both personally and professionally? As a part of this series, I had the pleasure of interviewing Dr. Alice Rizzi.
Dr. Alice Rizzi is a NY-licensed psychologist and mindfulness coach. She has a teletherapy private practice focused on supporting professional adults who want evidence-based skills to manage stress, anxiety, and OCD across New York and Florida. Dr. Rizzi is also the founder of Together Mindful, an online mindfulness school through which she teaches individuals across the world how awesome mindfulness is and how to integrate it into their lives for more happiness, peace, and freedom.
Thank you so much for doing this with us! Before we start, our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your childhood backstory?
Thank you for including me in this series! I’m so glad people are interested in becoming better listeners — a severely underappreciated and underutilized superpower. Fortunately, it’s a skill that can be learned!
I was born in Uzbekistan, grew up in Israel, and moved to New York with my parents when I was 10 years old. I consider myself both an immigrant and a New Yorker, especially since we lived in Staten Island, where you are forgotten half the time and reminded of your outsider status the other. I got my undergraduate degree from New York University and then my doctorate from La Salle University in Philadelphia. I commuted the entire time which is why I now treasure my ability to work from home.
Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?
One of my favorite quotes is, “The hardest thing in this world is to live in it. Be brave. Live.” It’s from “Buffy The Vampire Slayer.”
It applied to my younger self as a teenager, continues to apply to me in my adult life, and most definitely applies to the clients I work with. I think people expect life to be something else from a very young age. Whether it’s Disney movies we watched growing up, Hollywood and their predictable rom-coms, or our own families that unintentionally reinforce this belief — that life “should” be happy, easy, and good and that it’s wrong for it to feel hard or uncomfortable — or at the very least, something is wrong with you if you’re struggling. And while people are able to accept the fact that there are stressors and challenges and disasters in life, there’s still this romanticized belief that “things will be okay” and so they are inevitably disappointed when they don’t feel it.
What I like about this quote is that it’s honest. It doesn’t try to hide the truth. It says plain and simple, life is hard. And yeah, it takes a really brave person to keep encountering challenges and still continuing to choose to live. As a teen this was reassuring, and as an adult psychologist it’s spot-on. I work with individuals who have been through so much and come to me expecting to feel better. Instead, much of the time I tell them what they absolutely don’t want to hear: It’s going to keep being hard and they’re going to keep having to be brave and living. So then we talk about how to actually do that.
From a mindfulness perspective (which is what both of my businesses embody), this quote is all about acceptance. Accepting your current circumstances, accepting yourself as a human with the resources and choices you have, and then intentionally taking that next step in a values-based way.
Is there a particular book, podcast, or film that made a significant impact on you? Can you share a story or explain why it resonated with you so much?
The book that got me reading was “The Outsiders” by S.E. Hinton. I think I related most to Ponyboy because of his innocence. I must’ve been around the character’s age, about 14 years old, when I read it and I resonated deeply with that belief we just spoke about that things “should” be a certain way. And then BAM. They weren’t, both in the book and in my life. Now, nothing as dramatic as what happens in the story happened to me, but internally — mentally and emotionally — I felt understood by the author.
This book holds a special place in my heart, because prior to reading it, I had no interest in reading at all. It was something my parents always tried to force on me, saying reading is fun and how their favorite hobby was always to read, but that just turned me off more. I wanted nothing to do with it. After reading “The Outsiders” for a school assignment, I started reading more and more, probably because I resonated so much with the author’s candid internal dialogue that made me feel seen. Reading then took on a different meaning for me, one of connection, unlike any kind I experienced in real life.
Let’s now shift to the main part of our discussion. Let’s begin with a definition of terms so that each of us and our readers are on the same page. What exactly does being a good listener mean?
To me, being a good listener means making the other person feel heard and understood. It is listening in such a way that shows your partner (whether that’s a romantic partner, friend, boss, etc.) that you are engaged in the conversation and attending to the information they are presenting to you.
Why is effective listening such an important quality? Can you give a story or example to explain what you mean?
Effective listening is important because it has the ability to strengthen a relationship or tear it apart. If you can make the speaker feel heard, understood, and, in essence, important, they will feel more connected to you by the time they are done speaking. They may believe you have their best interest in mind and that you care about how they feel. On the flip side, if they believe that you are distracted, uninterested, and not paying attention to what they have to say, they may believe you don’t care about them, think they’re boring, don’t love them, aren’t attentive, or any other myriad of negative beliefs that may or may not be true.
From your experience or perspective, what are some of the common barriers that hold someone back from being a good listener?
A lot of the time, a person may simply be unaware that they appear to not be a good listener. They may be physically present and hearing the conversation, but if they don’t look like they’re listening the speaker may still be offended and feel unheard. So one barrier to not being a good listener is not looking like you are in fact listening by your body language.
Another barrier is assuming that listening means just hearing what a person is saying audibly, rather than engaging in a set of behaviors that indicate you are listening, both verbally and nonverbally (explained in the steps below). The barrier here is usually not knowing what you don’t know. If no one ever taught you or gave you feedback on how to listen, then how could you do it effectively? The great news is that once you learn and practice these steps you can turn yourself into a good listener who makes others feel heard, important, and emotionally taken care of. In turn, they may try to do the same for you or, at the very least, have higher positive regard towards you.
What are some practical techniques that have helped you become a more effective listener?
I consider there to be five key steps to becoming an effective listener. Four that describe what you do, and one that describes how to do it.
A) What you do after a person has spoken is paraphrase and summarize what they’ve said, check-in on whether your summary was accurate, and validate their emotions. Then, ask relevant questions as needed. This shows interest, engagement, and understanding in the person and the information they’ve presented. Try some of the following phrases:
- What I heard you say was… (This shows you’re on the same page and attending to the information.)
- Did I get that right? (This checks in on the accuracy of your understanding and allows them to fill in any gaps or correct any misunderstandings.)
- Tell me more about… or Can I ask you about x, y, z? (These show interest and curiosity which help them feel more important, special, and connected to you.)
B) How you do it involves verbal and nonverbal cues. Looking at the person while they’re speaking, nodding your head, not looking away or playing with your cellphone, and using subtle verbal nudges like “mhm,” “yeah,” “oh,” and “wow!” These may sound strange or obvious at first, but they do help the person feel like you are right on the edge of your seat, listening to every word that comes out of their mouth.
Here is the central question of our discussion. What are five ways that listening effectively can help someone succeed personally and professionally? If you can, please share a story or an example for each.
1 . Meaningful Relationships — Both personally and professionally, listening effectively can help you form stronger, more meaningful connections with people in your life. They will feel heard, understood, and cared for by you. This can lead to greater trust, respect, and dependability.
2 . Increased Self-Awareness — By learning to listen effectively you will have a better understanding of your own thoughts, feelings, and urges as you listen to the person speak. You will notice judgments and assumptions that arise for you, your emotional and physical reactions to what they’re saying, and urges or desires to respond in a specific way.
3 . Increased Other-Awareness — You get to learn a great deal about other people when you listen effectively. You’d be surprised at all the deep, dark secrets people are willing to share when they feel heard. Used for good, this means you can support them in the way they need, offer assistance, and be the best problem-solver they’ve ever had. Kind of like anticipating their needs in exactly the way they want — sometimes they won’t even remember they told you this but just appreciate your effort. Imagine how popular that might make you at work, school, or among your family and friends?
If you’ve ever wanted to be the go-to person for someone, the person they heavily rely on, depend on, and trust implicitly, using effective listening strategies as described above is the way to do it. People really love talking about themselves and as Dale Carnegie highlighted years ago in “How To Win Friends & Influence People,” getting people to talk about themselves and asking them questions is one of the best ways to leave them with a positive impression of you.
4 . Increased Freedom And Intentionality — By not reacting impulsively to what someone is saying, you are essentially practicing self-restraint, thinking before you speak, and choosing how to act based on what’s actually important to you. One of the key benefits I teach clients about practicing mindfulness is that you become less reactive and more responsive. This gives you the ability to act on your values rather than on momentary or automatic impulses. Practically, this means you get to act more like the kind of person you want to be rather than being governed by your emotions or situational stressors — all just from taking a pause and listening to someone else.
5 . Getting What You Want — Learning to listen to someone effectively gives you a higher chance of actually getting what you want via empathizing with others and supporting their emotional needs. When people feel heard and understood they’re more likely to help you in the future or align themselves with your point of view. This doesn’t mean there won’t ever be negative consequences with people you speak to or that others will always respond positively to you, but think of the phrase, “You catch more flies with honey than with vinegar.” When you engage others in meaningful conversation, they’ll remember how you made them feel and likely want to reciprocate in the future. Similarly, Maya Angelou is often quoted for saying, “I’ve learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel.” If you can make a person feel safe and seen in one conversation simply by mindfully attending to them, chances are they won’t forget you when it matters.
Something to reflect on is why you want to be an effective listener. Ideally, it’s less about manipulating others and getting them to bend to your will, and more because you find meaningful connections rewarding and enjoy getting to know others on a deeper level. That being said, it’s also okay to enjoy the positive outcomes of basic human decency and the perks of going above and beyond what other people are used to using just a few basic (learnable) skills. Making others feel heard and witnessing their sense of relief as they speak is a privilege to you as the listener and one of the greatest gifts to them.
You are a person of great influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be?
I would love to propel the mindfulness revolution. In the last few years I’ve encountered more and more people who know what mindfulness is, practice meditation, and many who teach both. The reason I started creating mindfulness courses is because I can see a future where mindfulness is a daily household practice, like brushing your teeth and showering. I believe that more mindful individuals will contribute to more loving and peaceful societies from which we can all benefit. It’s a really grand vision that essentially boils down to world peace and love. And while some might think it is unattainable or unrealistic, I have witnessed firsthand the good that just one mindful individual can do. (In fact, I’ve seen hundreds in my therapy practice). So why can’t we let ourselves believe in what a thousand or a million mindful individuals could do?
Is there a person in the world whom you would love to have lunch with, and why? Maybe we can tag them and see what happens!
I would love to have lunch with a mindfulness duo — Cory Muscara and Melli O’Brien. It doesn’t have to be at the same time, but since they co-created my favorite mindfulness app it seems fitting to meet both. I’ve been following Melli since 2015 when she hosted the Mindfulness Summit. She interviewed some of the world’s most well-known mindfulness teachers and researchers and I had the privilege of listening to them through my graduate mindfulness research team. I don’t remember 100% when I learned of Cory, but I think it was around the time that both of them released the Mindfulness+ app. With a website called www.mindfulness.com it’s hard to miss!
The reason I’d love to meet them both is, while I feel like I know a lot about their personal journeys through their social media, I’m really interested in getting to know them on a deeper, more human level. At the same time, I’m also interested in their professional experiences educating others on mindfulness. While it’s a topic I wholeheartedly love talking about, I’ve found it to be quite a hard sell. I really believe mindfulness can help you be a happier, healthier, and more conscious human being who lives a fulfilling and meaningful life. Seriously. I’ve not met anyone who’s been worse off for having learned about mindfulness or hasn’t gained anything positive from it at all. But when that’s how you talk about it, people start looking at you like you’re selling snake oil or tickets to the fountain of youth. I’m curious about what their experiences have been practicing, teaching, and selling this grand topic.
How can our readers continue to follow your work online?
Instagram: @dralicerizzi
Mindfulness Courses: www.TogetherMindful.com
Teletherapy in NY & FL: www.DrAliceRizzi.com
Thank you so much for sharing these important insights. We wish you continued success and good health!
About the Interviewer: Douglas E. Noll, JD, MA was born nearly blind, crippled with club feet, partially deaf, and left-handed. He overcame all of these obstacles to become a successful civil trial lawyer. In 2000, he abandoned his law practice to become a peacemaker. His calling is to serve humanity, and he executes his calling at many levels. He is an award-winning author, teacher, and trainer. He is a highly experienced mediator. Doug’s work carries him from international work to helping people resolve deep interpersonal and ideological conflicts. Doug teaches his innovative de-escalation skill that calms any angry person in 90 seconds or less. With Laurel Kaufer, Doug founded Prison of Peace in 2009. The Prison of Peace project trains life and long terms incarcerated people to be powerful peacemakers and mediators. He has been deeply moved by inmates who have learned and applied deep, empathic listening skills, leadership skills, and problem-solving skills to reduce violence in their prison communities. Their dedication to learning, improving, and serving their communities motivates him to expand the principles of Prison of Peace so that every human wanting to learn the skills of peace may do so. Doug’s awards include California Lawyer Magazine Lawyer of the Year, Best Lawyers in America Lawyer of the Year, Purpose Prize Fellow, International Academy of Mediators Syd Leezak Award of Excellence, National Academy of Distinguished Neutrals Neutral of the Year. His four books have won a number of awards and commendations. Doug’s podcast, Listen With Leaders, is now accepting guests. Click on this link to learn more and apply.
