Karen Laos On The 5 Things You Need To Be A Highly Effective Public Speaker

An Interview With Fotis Georgiadis

Avoid the Curse of Knowledge: Have a relevant, relatable, and audience-focused message. This happens all the time. People launch into their talk with an assumption that the audience is in their head or knows as much as they do — enter the Curse of Knowledge. The more expert we are in our field, the harder it is to see things through the lens of our audience. The truth is, we often don’t even realize it. We jump in with what we want to say and hope it lands.

At some point in our lives, many of us will have to give a talk to a large group of people. What does it take to be a highly effective public speaker? How can you improve your public speaking skills? How can you overcome a fear of speaking in public? What does it take to give a very interesting and engaging public talk? In this interview series called “5 Things You Need To Be A Highly Effective Public Speaker” we are talking to successful and effective public speakers to share insights and stories from their experience. As a part of this series, we had the pleasure of interviewing Karen Laos.

Karen Laos, Communication Expert and Confidence Cultivator, teaches women leaders how to be influential communicators and speak up with confidence in the boardroom and beyond. Through practical strategies that outline what to say and how to say it, Karen is fiercely committed to eradicating self-doubt in 10 million women within 10 years. With 20+ years of public speaking experience, Karen has graced stages all over the world and coached corporations and individuals with the concrete skills to transform self-doubt and missed opportunities into empowered growth, more clients, job promotions, and negotiated deals. She specializes in presence and direct messaging through an approachable and engaging manner, equipping women to stand out through declarative, impactful speech and leaving them empowered with practical tools they can apply immediately. Tapping into her background in human resources, Karen incorporates introspection and the power of trusting our own voices, taking her clients on a journey where they’re no longer dependent on others’ opinions. By breaking down perfection-induced communication barriers, Karen is able to build trust and credibility quickly and has worked with giants like NASA, Google, Netflix, Facebook, Sephora, Sony, and more. At age 52, Karen left her corporate career, where she led a team of facilitators and traveled the globe consulting professionals on their communication skills. Her passion started with her love for people and discovering the field of HR, through which she moved into corporate training with a focus on leadership and trained people on strategies that ultimately impact the bottom line. Whether people decide to buy from you, do business with you, trust you, etc., can all be traced back to the words we use and how we use them, which is at the heart of her work. Karen is the author of a guidebook called Trust Your Own Voice: Growing Your Influence Through Confident Communication, as well as the podcast host of Ignite Your Confidence, through which she helps women to stop holding back and start taking their seat at the table. When she’s not equipping women in business, you can find her exploring a new city, living and working like a local anywhere she goes. She’s been to all 50 states, traveled to many countries including Dubai, Israel, and The North Pole, as well as chasing her dream of living in Manhattan by renting an apartment for a month to celebrate her 50th birthday.

Thank you so much for doing this with us! Our readers would love to get to know you a bit better. Can you tell us the story of how you grew up?

When I was six years old, my dad taught me to negotiate at flea markets. He handed me a few dollars and told me to never pay full price. That’s how I got confidence to ask for what I want. He also taught me that “the squeaky wheel gets the grease” and “you don’t have because you don’t ask.” He taught me that with enough persistence and determination you could do anything you want. I learned the payoff of working hard and smart.

On the flip side, watching my parent’s marriage, I learned that you have to submit to a man or the one in charge (in my case, my dad was both). As a result of this, I learned to be a compliant little girl who was always trying to please her dad. My mom was submissive in the household, but a powerhouse in the community. My dad wouldn’t let her get a job, but she was head of a bunch of organizations. Service to the community was important in our family.

She started several ministries at church and received an award for her work with the Little League organization. She raised nine kids, and I was the baby. Two of my siblings passed away, so our family was no stranger to grief. I was too young to remember those deaths, but I watched my mom be a positive force no matter what. She started a grief ministry at our church, too. Her faith was critical to her and she always taught me that you can talk to Jesus as your best friend.

Ever since I was little, I loved people. I would come home from first grade and ask my mom if I could either have someone over, or go to someone’s house — a classic extrovert. I played tennis, flute, and sang at our church and in choir. I was the class president in high school, and competed in speaking events through DECA (Distributive Education Clubs of America) like sales and marketing, traveling nationally to do so.

I was raised in the suburbs of Minneapolis but always had a passion for travel and adventure. I had a dream of going to Manhattan and also San Francisco. At 16, I chose to take German, as that was the one language that had an upcoming trip overseas, and I spent two weeks with my class in Germany and lived with a host family there who I am still in touch with.

Can you share a story with us about what brought you to this specific career path?

Ever since I was a kid, I wanted to be speaking on a stage. Fast forward to my first HR manager role, I remember participating in an offsite training and salivating over the facilitator’s job. I couldn’t have imagined a career like that (corporate trainer and speaker). You get to travel around and talk to people, while having fun and making teams build better relationships? I approached her to ask her advice on how I could start doing that. I was so disappointed when she told me to “just start.” I didn’t know what she meant. Soon after, I realized you have to speak anywhere you can, and eventually opportunities start opening up. It takes a lot of intention and vision boards! It worked.

When I was first starting out, people used to say, “Do what you love, and the money will follow.” I never liked that because the money wasn’t following quickly! I’ve adapted it to “Do what you love, and the money will follow…eventually!”

I kept staying attuned to new opportunities and eventually was on a clear path to my speaking career. Fast forward to Sept of 2019, I put a stake in the ground to go full-time with my speaking and created a formula from that called the 3D’s: Decide (what you want to do), Declare it (tell everyone you know), and Do it (take action!).

Can you tell us the most interesting story that happened to you since you began your career?

This speaks to the power of knowing and owning your worth. In February of 2020, I secured the highest executive coaching contract I’ve ever had. I was thrilled. Then COVID happened, and the company decided against it. I continued to follow up every few months, and I had just about given up on the business after a year of following up. Out of the blue, the person within the company that was looking for coaching reached out to me over a year later. She was desperate for my help and said the CEO had approved the coaching. When I looked back at the contract, I was surprised at how low it was compared to my then current rates, as well as the length of the contract. I decided to take the risk and ask for nearly three times as much with a slightly longer contract. They said yes! I shared how I continue to learn that sustainable change takes time, intention and support, along with the fact that I’m in more demand now, so my rates have increased.

Can you share a story about the funniest mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?

I remember way back in high school when I had given my first speech. I thought I did amazingly well, and when the teacher shared her feedback with me, I was shocked. She said, “Well, the speech was good, but you looked up at the ceiling the entire time!” I learned that you need to look at people and connect with your audience instead of the ceiling!

Fast forward to my corporate training job in 2006. When I had to present in front of my boss so she could sign off before I could present to clients, I was super nervous, but had diligently prepared and knew the material well. After I was done, I thought I nailed it. When she gave her feedback, I was astonished. She said, “Well, if I really listened, the content was practically perfect. But, you looked mad the whole time!” I was so surprised, but here’s what I learned that’s still a powerful lesson today: we can’t sacrifice connection for perfection. It’s okay if you’re not 100% perfect with the material. If you don’t smile or lighten up in your facial expression, you can look unapproachable and uninviting, so they won’t hear much of your content anyway!

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story about that?

Dennis Del Valle, executive coach, therapist, and Townsend Leadership Director has been invaluable in my growth journey. When we first started working together, he was teaching me the power of feeling my feelings. As a high achieving corporate woman, I didn’t have time for feelings. Yet, I was stressed about something and he asked me to put my hand on the spot on my body where I was feeling the tension. While I had my hand on my stomach, I was a little annoyed. I said, “I’m paying you $150/hour to put my hand on my stomach?” He kindly chuckled. Because I trusted him, I trusted the process. I learned how powerful it is to recognize your feelings and feel them. This gives space for those feelings and then allows them to pass, creating space for new things to blossom, and it’s incredibly healing to experience the feeling and then move forward.

You have been blessed with great success in a career path that can be challenging and intimidating. Do you have any words of advice for others who may want to embark on this career path, but seem daunted by the prospect of failure?

Yes! It’s both exhilarating and exhausting. I have two favorite F words: Fun and Failure. Failure is the path to success. You have to recognize that you need to go through it — without risk comes no reward. You don’t want to play it safe. It’s so much more fun to risk failure and to learn from it. I will remind everyone that it’s never going to be easy, but I’d rather live with knowing that I tried rather than not trying at all. And remember — it’s all about how you look at it. Failure is actually to be celebrated because it means you learned.

Your dreams are waiting for you, and the only one holding you back is you. You are brilliant, beautiful, and brave. Get support so you have people around you, and surround yourself with experts who you can learn from. Immerse yourself in learning about your craft. There’s always someone who has gone before you who has done it before. Ask for help; talk with anyone you can. People are willing to help but you have to ask. You are worth it.

It’s important to remember that YOUR voice is powerful and important. The world is waiting for you! Start with one step today.

What drives you to get up everyday and give your talks? What is the main empowering message that you aim to share with the world?

My mission is to teach 10 million women to overcome self-doubt, speak up with confidence, and empower themselves to get what they want. No more missed opportunities! I want women to be free: to speak up without hesitation, to stop holding back, and to share their ideas without worrying about what people think or without needing permission.

A recent client was working as a consultant and had a hard time speaking up for herself. There was no contract and there were a lot of gray areas. She wanted to do a good job for the client, but she was being taken advantage of. Yet, part of it was her fault. She kept taking on more work without getting paid for all of it. She had been feeling resentful, knowing that things needed to change. After two sessions with me, she spoke up for herself. Here’s what she told me: “I stood up for myself. I held my ground. I now have this power I didn’t know was available to me. You gave me permission to ask. I didn’t have role models before.”

One of my favorite “right-after-stage” moments was one of the best compliments I’ve ever been given: “I felt like we were in my living room and you were talking just to me, even though we’re in a room of 200 people!” When I hear stories like this, I know I’m touching people; making an impact, and the work I do matters.

The main message I aim to share with the world is: Your voice is powerful. Trust it!

You have such impressive work. What are some of the most interesting or exciting projects you are working on now? Where do you see yourself heading from here?

I’m working on a confident communication hotline show where people can call in with everyday questions such as “How do I negotiate when the person says, ‘No thanks?’ Can I turn that around?” or “What is the best way to interject in meetings? I want to speak up, but it’s challenging for me,” or “I’m having a conflict with my boss. How do I speak my truth and still keep the relationship intact?”

My dream is to be the main event at the Chase Center in San Francisco within the next 10 years. I can’t imagine anything more powerful than a stadium full of women being inspired and equipped to communicate with confidence. At a women’s faith conference back in 2021, the speaker had us do a vision exercise. She said, “Let the Holy Spirit take over your pen.” While that may seem odd to some, it was exactly what I was meant to hear. I asked God to speak to me, and the vision that came into my head was me speaking at an open air stadium at dusk filled with women. I was wearing a white t-shirt and a warm summer breeze gently flowed over us with the most empowering feeling ever!

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?

“Be direct, honest and kind.” My mom lived by that motto, and I do, too. When you keep those three things at the forefront, life is better. You have stronger relationships and peace. Also, my mom always said that if you’re invited to a party, go! That philosophy has served me well, too. I’ve had so many unexpected opportunities because I said “yes” to adventure! One of the best examples of that is when I was in Bangkok, and the host showing me around asked if I wanted to ride an elephant. Of course I said, “YES, please!” And had the time of my life. Life is filled with opportunities — we have to look for them and if we pay attention, we create experiences worth memories for a lifetime.

Ok, thank you for all that. Here is the main question of our interview. What are your “5 Things You Need To Be A Highly Effective Public Speaker?” Please share a story or example for each.

1. Mindset: Be prepared and do the growth work needed. Remember that you can do this. It takes time, intention, and support. One of my clients worked for years toward getting a TEDx talk. She spent hours working on her signature talk, refining and refining it. Her humility and openness to look at her blind spots was an inspiration. She would record herself on video and we would review it together. Her tendency was to get into what I call “presenter mode” instead of being her conversational self. She worked hard to be as conversational as possible and it paid off! She got her first TEDx, and it was amazing!

2. Have a clear point to your message: Too often we bury the lead of our story and it falls flat. We give too much detail and end up losing people because they’re confused. One of my client’s jobs as the head of finances for an energy company in Texas was to present to the board of directors every year. He would typically present a bunch of slides with the financial performance — usually on Excel spreadsheets. It was SO tedious and boring. We worked together to craft a story instead. At first he couldn’t think of anything and almost gave up, but I kept pushing him to find something. We talked about his interests outside of work, and then it came to him! This is the analogy he used that was a huge success: “What’s the first thing you do when you walk into a football stadium, after you get your beer and popcorn? The scoreboard! That’s what we’re going to go over today.”

3. Recognize the power of connection. People won’t listen to your content if they don’t feel a connection with you. The key to doing this is through your eye contact and your facial expressions. Many years back, I was about to facilitate a corporate training on presentation skills. As I greeted people walking in the room, one of the participants shook my hand and my immediate impression was,”This guy is going to be challenging.” simply because of his facial expression.

He came across unfriendly and almost a little intimidating. It turns out he was a nice guy with a great sense of humor. When we played back the video recording of his presentation, we looked at it together and he said, “Whoa! I look so rude and intimidating.” I said, “I know, that’s exactly what I thought of you when I met you this morning!” Ha! I would’ve never said that had he not seen his video. Him seeing that for himself was the connection. I could’ve told him directly, but the power came in his own discovery. The bigger “aha” for him was that how he was coming across didn’t represent his personality. I said, “I agree. My first impression of you was very different from how you actually are.”

• His big takeaway: “I’ve got to intentionally smile so that I bring out my personality when I meet people; especially for the first time. Same thing goes for how I am around my team. I don’t want them to think I’m intimidating or rude.”

4. Demonstrate Credibility. Know your stuff and also recognize that your voice is critical to someone deciding if they think you’re worth listening to. Speak with conviction in your voice and pause to show control and avoid filler words like “um” and “ah.”

On January 9, 2021, I joined Clubhouse (the social media chat room app), and my world shifted. It became extremely obvious that our voices influence quickly. I know that people decide within seconds if they think you’re credible, trustworthy, and likable, but wow, this app made that abundantly clear. There’s a button called “Leave Quietly” which allows you to leave the virtual room. I used it a fair amount!

Here’s what was sobering: the amount of women misrepresenting themselves. It was mind-boggling and reminded me that there is much work to be done.

For example, I have a friend with 25 years of experience in her field, and she was hosting a room for the first time (leading and moderating discussion). Marlene is a strong, well-spoken woman; a leader in her field.

She started that room so tentatively in her speech and I thought, “Oh my gosh, this doesn’t even sound like her.” She came across so timid and meek; halting in her voice with lots of awkward pauses. She wasn’t taking charge or leading us in the conversation.

That was a reminder of how many women are walking around misrepresenting themselves. I was shocked at how different she sounded compared to how I know her.

5. Avoid the Curse of Knowledge: Have a relevant, relatable, and audience-focused message. This happens all the time. People launch into their talk with an assumption that the audience is in their head or knows as much as they do — enter the Curse of Knowledge. The more expert we are in our field, the harder it is to see things through the lens of our audience. The truth is, we often don’t even realize it. We jump in with what we want to say and hope it lands.

Our job is to translate the knowledge in our heads to the audience in a way that’s understandable, relatable, and memorable.

The Curse of Knowledge is also when we use jargon or buzzwords that people don’t understand. For example, I had a physical injury a few years ago and the doctor kept saying, “The calcaneus this, the calcaneus that,” and after several minutes I finally asked, “What’s the calcaneus?”

He said, “Oh, it’s your heel bone.” That’s when I said to myself, “I wish I had known that when you first started talking, Doc.” Too often we don’t take time to think about who our audience is and what matters to them, and adjust our message appropriately.

This desire to prove ourselves makes us feel like we need to convince someone and share all that we know or have done. The truth is, we don’t need more content. What we need is simplicity. Focus instead of fumbling.

As you know, many people are terrified of speaking in public. Can you give some of your advice about how to overcome this fear?

Physiologically, there is no difference between nervousness and excitement. You can trick your brain to channel this energy by simply saying, “I’m so excited to speak” instead of saying, “I’m so nervous.” This changes up the neural pathways in our brains so we can move toward overcoming those fears. Also, record yourself on video and watch it back with a coach (like me!) or someone objective who can encourage and challenge you.

You are a person of huge influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be?

I would inspire a “Be Kind” movement and it would be called the Flo Movement (Florence was my mom’s name and this was her motto and how she lived her life). What it would be in action is for every person on the planet to be intentional about kindness; to be attuned to others. What that would look like is to set aside differences and have a “for” stance with others. It would mean we might have to let go of being right and value the relationship more. It would be focusing on others instead of ourselves (except we still need to have boundaries, which is being kind to ourselves!). It would mean kind self-talk.

Is there a person in the world whom you would love to have lunch with, and why? Maybe we can tag them and see what happens!

Yes! I would love to have lunch with Mel Robbins. Her story of overcoming hardship is transformational, and she is changing so many others’ lives because she is consistently encouraging people to take action. Her message is empowering and inspiring. I love how down-to-earth and real she is.

Are you on social media? How can our readers follow you online?

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/KarenLaosConsulting/

Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/karenlaosconsulting

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/karenlaosofficial

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/karenlaos/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/Karen_Laos

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCEwQoTGdJX5eME0ccBKiKng/videos

Clubhouse: @karenlaos

This was so informative, thank you so much! We wish you continued success!