Power Women: Peggy Sullivan of SheCAN! On How to Successfully Navigate Work, Love and Life as A Powerful Woman

An Interview with Ming Zhao

Be kind and helpful to everyone. In a world where we have so many choices, it is so important to choose to be kind and helpful. I am currently at a conference and am using the bellman to help me find a taxi every day. He is truly the grumpiest bell man I have ever met. I decided to buy him coffee and a donut this morning. He asked me why I did it. I told him that he was the first person that many people spoke to day in and day out. It was funny how this small gesture turned him into a really nice man. Kindness and helpfulness usually cost very little. It is never the wrong thing to do the right thing.

How does a successful, strong, and powerful woman navigate work, employee relationships, love, and life in a world that still feels uncomfortable with strong women? In this interview series, called “Power Women” we are talking to accomplished women leaders who share their stories and experiences navigating work, love, and life as a powerful woman.

As a part of this series, I had the distinct pleasure of interviewing Peggy Sullivan.

Peggy Sullivan is a women’s leadership speaker, mindset expert, and founder of the nonprofit organization, SheCAN! She is also the author of the book, Happiness is Your Responsibility. She has won numerous awards and honors, including the 2019 Woman in Leadership Award from New York State. Peggy has also presented and consulted worldwide for organizations, such as Bank of America, Blue Cross BlueShield, Ingram Micro, and WomanUp Conferences.

Thank you so much for doing this with us! Before we dig in, our readers would like to get to know you a bit more. Can you tell us a bit about your childhood “backstory?”

As a child I was awkward, insecure, and painfully shy — the polar opposite of the woman I am today. Like many children growing up, I just wanted to be popular and fit in but glasses, braces, and a pixie haircut contributed to a lack of self-confidence. I did not fit in everywhere I went. The term imposter syndrome had not made its debut yet, but for most of my childhood I was uncomfortable in my own skin. I always tried too hard to blend in but could not find my sweet spot. Most kids rave about their childhood. My experience was different; I can remember being exceptionally hard on myself. My life was uneventful until third grade, when I found something I was passionate about and learned with hard work, I could do anything I set my mind to.

I wanted to do gymnastics and be good enough to compete. I would often watch other children and marvel at their aptitude. I was told I did not have the skillset, body strength, or talent needed to be good and should investigate playing a musical instrument. I was passionate about gymnastics, not the violin, so every day I would go and watch the after-school gymnastic program. For three years, I tried out for the team but was never good enough. Other children in the neighborhood hired coaches to provide lessons, but we could not afford it. So, I learned how to study others and practiced countless hours until I got better. After 3 long years of team tryouts, I finally made it in the sixth grade. My hard work and persistence paid off.

By seventh grade, the sport became a huge passion of mine and I wanted to be good enough to compete. I would practice every day before and after school, as well as at night in my backyard before it was dark. I began to see the fruits of all my hard work and dedication begin to blossom. I got better and eventually started winning. Looking back, it was never about the awards or mastering something so many told me was impossible. Early in life, I learned a fundamental strategy I would use throughout my lifetime: hard work, discipline, and resilience. I believe, wholeheartedly, learning these skills at such a young age changed the direction of my life.

Can you tell us the story about what led you to this particular career path?

I worked in male-dominated vocations most of my life. My peers, mentors, and employees were mostly men. Being so career-focused, I did not have a lot of extra time for making female friends. I would often fantasize about the power inherent to a like minded, female community where women would receive the tools, training, and support they need to thrive in their lives. I never had that.

For too long, women have viewed themselves as competition in the workspace and in everyday life. I have always been an innovator of sorts and thought women should collaborate more. Today, my non-profit SheCAN! is all about giving women the tools they need to grow, thrive, and find their vibe. My work to help others, especially women, is what my soul wants to do. I help women show up as better versions of themselves in all areas of their lives, from being mothers, to their work or business, to who they are as individuals. It is truly a gift to be of service and watch them succeed and step into their power.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began your career?

I can still remember the first time I interviewed and started a senior executive position. Shortly after the final interview with the owner, as I was walking to the elevator, I overheard my new boss say, “I cannot believe I just hired a woman — and a Jewish one at that.” That was when I first realized I would be working in a male-dominated company where I was more than a minority, — I was the only female executive.

The first leadership meeting I attended went silent as soon as I entered the room. I heard one of my peers say, “We are going to have to watch our P’s-and-Qs from now on; there’s a female among us.” I thought for a moment about what they said, and I had to reply regardless of the comment, which was not meant for my ears. I told them, “I am a hard-working woman and have something to bring to the table. If you can spare an open-minded attitude, I will work hard and make magic happen.” I asked them what their challenges were and by the next meeting, I came back with a few suggested solutions that ultimately made a lot of money for the organization. From that moment on, I was rarely treated as an equal, but I was respected.

You are a successful business leader. Which three character traits do you think were most instrumental to your success? Can you please share a story or example for each?

Being a Risk Taker. I have always been a risk taker and when I started my non-profit ShecAN!, it was one of the hardest things I ever did. I had no experience and a big vision. I did market research to test my theory that women needed tools, training, and community to rise up and become their best. At first, I wanted to find a franchise but could not find one that had the three foundational pillars women need to be successful on their terms: Positive Mindset, Health & Wellness, and Professional Development. I could not find a franchise with those very specific values, so I decided to build it from scratch — no easy task. For most of my career, I worked in male-saturated industries and had few women friends to support me and my vision. I decided to Google the leaders in my community and reached out to them to ask for their help. Suddenly, I had a board of directors to help and guide me. While it was not easy with the skill set and power of so many talented women, we were able to make it happen. Being a risk taker enabled me to walk away from a successful job and start something that really fueled my passions.

Being a Supportive leader. I try to focus on practicing abundant, generous leadership. Operating with abundance is about leading, observing, and responding in a way that lets your team know you have their back and will support them on reaching their potential. As a leader, my job is to recognize potential in people and set them up for success. That means helping them navigate difficult challenges, trusting them to find the best solutions, and supporting them when they take risks. Seeing people rise to the occasion is among the most rewarding parts of my job. For example, one of my new hires was terrified of public speaking. So, I told her she was going to give a speech and I would help every step of the way until she felt ready. I helped her develop the content and practice until she had it was as natural as breathing. She aced it, and everyone loved her. I was so proud of her; she now speaks regularly.

Have a solution orientation that sees challenges as opportunities. Two years into starting my nonprofit, SheCAN!, which primarily revolved around live, in-person events, COVDI-19 hit and…no more events. I quickly learned women are going through an extremely stressful and challenging time. Our roles and responsibilities grew to enormous proportions. Women were really struggling to stay ahead of the curve. Most of us were drowning in areas we never had to navigate before, like homeschooling or understanding how to keep our families healthy and safe. Not to mention the loss of social situations that relieve stress and encourage positivity, like going to the gym or out for dinner with a group of girls. I knew women needed real-time support on a regular basis, so I took our organization virtual.

At first, navigating virtual events was a challenge but, quickly, we all learned the technology. The bigger challenge was being there for them on a regular basis with positivity, fresh content, and solutions on how to navigate this difficult space. I started speaking and researching content. It was not unusual for me to speak several times a week. This got exhausting quickly. It was at that point in time I Googled the top fifty speakers nationally and reached out to each of them to ask for their help. It was amazing — over 70-percent of the cold calls and LinkedIn connections were willing to give their time and energy to help other women find their way in these tough times. This challenge turned into an opportunity and changed my perspective on doing hard things.

Ok, thank you for that. Let us now jump to the primary focus of our interview. The premise of this series assumes that our society still feels uncomfortable with strong women. Why do you think this is so?

Women ask for and want more these days. Our core values are changing. We still love family and caregiving but for women like me, it is not enough. I want to live a life that fuels me. I want to make a difference and spend my time doing things that are important. My 88-year-old aunt still believes I should be cooking and cleaning more often. I do not enjoy those tasks and do not want to spend my time in that capacity. The traditional roles of females are changing. The doors we cracked open in woman’s historic march towards equality were not opened wide enough. Many still think a woman’s hopes and dreams are expendable, but we are not second-class citizens. We deserve to be taken seriously and given the opportunity to succeed.

My husband has taken over many of the traditions of our household. He helps because he sees how happy I am, how much my work means to me, and the satisfaction I get from it. He knows I need support to continue at the pace of progress I am making. This did not happen overnight but was more of a transition. It takes an open mind to flip traditional roles over. History has been very slow to adapt to the growing needs of women, as well as other diverse populations. As a woman, I am tired of being exhausted and frustrated. I want more and deserve more. So do my sisters. Change is hard for some, but we are hitting momentum and will soon become a tidal wave too big to ignore or underestimate.

Without saying any names, can you share a story from your own experience that illustrates this idea?

My husband is retired, despite the fact he is 10 years my junior. My career is on fire, and I am incredibly busy doing things that I believe add value and empower other women. He has taken over the day-to-day household responsibilities which were previously mine; he often is teased for how much he does. I never take his support for granted and appreciate everything he does. We do not have the typical household. It works for us but seems to be a spectacle many people cannot understand or support. His friends tease him a lot and it can really wear him down, but at the end of the day, he helps because I need and value it.

What should a powerful woman do in a context where she feels that people are uneasy around her?

There are three key strategies a woman can utilize to lighten things up — the first is humor. Humor and laughter relax almost any situation. The second is being a good listener. God gave us two ears and one mouth for a reason. Truly understanding and adding value means listening; this is criticall. Lastly, we need more confidence, self-love, and forgiveness. Life is messy. It is okay to be one hot mess. I embrace my imperfections and messiness. We need to stop apologizing when things are chaotic or not the way we think they should be.

What do we need to do as a society to change the unease around powerful women?

As a society, we need to create more opportunities for women to pursue their passions. Being super busy but not happy is no longer the life of choice. The best approach, and one that is truly hitting momentum, is women empowering other women. We have a deep understanding of each other; sharing our recipes for success should be happening on a more regular basis. I would like to see more women telling their stories and sharing the tools they used to get there. There was a time when women competed with each other. Now is the time for collaboration.

In my own experience, I have observed that often women have to endure ridiculous or uncomfortable situations to achieve success that men do not have to endure. Do you have a story like this from your own experience? Can you share it with us?

I worked for a company that used precious metals in their manufacturing facilities. They implemented a security system that did not allow for any metal to go into the plant or pass through the security system. I was asked to wear a wireless bra. I had breast surgery and needed the support of an underwire bra. While my position in senior management was more front office, I often went into manufacturing to learn more about our product line and to get to know the workers. I had to get a note from a doctor to wear an underwire bra. Obviously, the men did not have a similar situation and felt no level of empathy for my unique needs.

In your opinion, what are the biggest challenges faced by women leaders that are not typically faced by their male counterparts?

Women are often underestimated. The status quo says we cannot do hard things or things that require physical and mental strength. We are not the softer sex; we are strong and capable of bearing great weight on our shoulders and juggling competing priorities. We can handle stress. We can handle, and learn from, failure. We can, and do, the hard things.

Let us now shift our discussion to a slightly different direction. This is a question that nearly everyone with a job has to contend with. Was it difficult to fit your personal and family life into your business and career? For the benefit of our readers, can you articulate precisely what the struggle was?

For years, women have juggled the needs of our family members with our jobs while trying to live the life we were taught to expect. We bought hook, line, and sinker into the promise of having it all — trying like heck to make it all work. But, in reality, we’re always straining, stressing, obsessing, and worrying.

Striking a work-life balance when you are a mother, a daughter, and an employee sounds lovely in theory but in practice, is extremely challenging. The pandemic added its own unique combination of stressors, like homeschooling, childcare issues, and the loss of our security net of friends, neighbors, and grandparents who we relied on. There is an unrealistic expectation placed on American working women that they can do and have it all. There are always choices to be made and priorities to consider. The anxiety of trying to do and be it all is frightening, frustrating, and confusing — not to mention many times filled with anger, guilt, and despair. How did we get here? I stopped struggling with all of this when I decided life is messy. I cannot do it all. Life is a series of choices and I need to cut myself some slack and realize I am at my best when I have some down and fun time.

What was a tipping point that helped you achieve a greater balance or greater equilibrium between your work life and personal life? What did you do to reach this equilibrium?

I have learned there is a big difference between being busy and being happy. I used to be one of those hard working, “you can have it all” women — big salary, lots of authority, worldwide travel. It looked great from the outside. I can remember a time when I had to look at post-it notes to remember which country I was in, which time zone it was, and what I needed to do that day. I was actually exhausted from working all the time. My marriage was failing and I had no time for pursuing my passions, things that gave me joy. My stress levels were through the roof. I was busy, but I was not happy. Filled but not fulfilled. Fast forward to the present and I am the happiest I have ever been. I took control of my happiness. I took the time to understand what my passion and purpose was.

I have written a book. People pay me to speak and coach. I am also the founder of an international nonprofit organization that is expanding, with our newest chapter in Dubai getting off the ground. Today, I am more joyous in my life than I ever have been because I went through the process of understanding what fuels me and how to manage my priorities to make it happen day in and day out.

I work in the beauty tech industry, so I am very interested to hear your philosophy or perspective about beauty. In your role as a powerful woman and leader, how much of an emphasis do you place on your appearance?

I always try to look my best but for me, that is not always about dressing up or wearing makeup. It is about being healthy and looking healthy. I love the feeling when I dress up for something. It makes me feel powerful and alive. There is something really fun about getting all dolled up. But, it is not an everyday occurrence for me. I spend plenty of days in t-shirts, yoga pants, and a ponytail on top of my head. And, if it means I must go to a meeting directly after I work out and I am a little messy after a good sweat, it is well worth it.

Do you see beauty as something that is superficial, or is it something that has inherent value for a leader in a public context? Can you explain what you mean?

For me, what makes someone beautiful is their inner beauty. I can admire a good-looking woman or somebody who is put together but for me, the rubber meets the road when they are a good person who helps make the world a better place.

How is this similar or different for men?

Men can be less self-conscious than women. Most men, or the ones I know, put far less attention into making themselves look good. It is just not a priority for most of them. And certainly, a good or terribly bad hair day will not affect their ability to enjoy their day.

Ok super. Here is the main question of our interview. Based on your opinion, what are the “Five Things You Need to Thrive and Succeed as a Powerful Woman?” (Please share a story or example for each.)

• Happiness is your individual responsibility. I learned at a young age happiness is my individual responsibility, as well as a choice. My mom died very young. She had a brain tumor and was later diagnosed with pancreatic cancer. My mom experienced a rough couple of years before she died. She was frustrated, angry, sad, and despondent — until one day she was not. I remembered that day so clearly in the hospital.
  One day, I visited her and I noticed a drastic change in her mood. She was really happy. So, I asked her what changed. She said she understood the secret to making a good life. Although she had terminal cancer and no control over it, she could choose to be happy and enjoy the rest of her life with her family doing things she loved. I thought if my mom could be happy under her circumstances, I could as well.
• Know your values…what makes you feel alive. Being busy does not mean you are living a life you are excited about. The difference between surviving and thriving is prioritizing the things that are important to you. There was a time in my life when all I did was eat, work, sleep, and repeat. it would not be unusual for me to work 12-hour days. One night, I came home around 10:00 PM after starting my day at 7:00 AM. I was so hungry I could have eaten my arm and so was my pet cat. I grabbed a handful of pistachio nuts and threw some cat food in the food bowl. I woke up later that night to gagging noises. It was my cat throwing up pistachios. I realized I had eaten a handful of cat food. I was not living a life where I focused on what is important. I was not focused on my values; there was no joy or passion in my life. I dreaded getting up in the morning. Life was not fun and that is when I started my journey to thriving, knowing my values and what’s important to me. Today, I live a value-driven life.
• Be kind and helpful to everyone. In a world where we have so many choices, it is so important to choose to be kind and helpful. I am currently at a conference and am using the bellman to help me find a taxi every day. He is truly the grumpiest bell man I have ever met. I decided to buy him coffee and a donut this morning. He asked me why I did it. I told him that he was the first person that many people spoke to day in and day out. It was funny how this small gesture turned him into a really nice man. Kindness and helpfulness usually cost very little. It is never the wrong thing to do the right thing.
• Have a growth mindset. When you are open minded, everything is possible. When you are closed minded, your options are extremely limited. I heard my first flat tire the other day. I never learned how to change a flat tire. Honestly, I never wanted to learn how. Usually, I would just call AAA. When I called, there was a four-hour wait. I decided to be open minded and YouTube’dhow to change a flat tire. Not only did I save time, but space, too. I felt good about learning something new.
• Fail forward. I used to think failing was a horrible thing. As I look back on my life, every time I failed I learned something valuable. My first marriage lasted 20 years but eventually led to divorce. I felt like a failure. For the longest period, I beat myself up about losing a good man and what I could have, should have done differently. After a period of grieving, I realized yes, this was a failure of sorts, but also an opportunity to re-calibrate my life. At that time, I did not believe I would ever recover.

The reality is, this failure gave me an opportunity to think about what it really means to have a life partner. It took a while, but I met a man who is truly amazing. We have been married fourteen years. I cannot imagine spending the rest of my life with anyone else. Had my first marriage not failed, I would not have had the opportunity to move on to something even more satisfying. Failing is not always a bad thing.

Thank you for these fantastic insights. We appreciate the time you spent on this.