Samuel Devyver Of EasyLlama On What You Should Do If Your Employer Is Not Willing To Make Reasonable Accommodations For Your Disability
An Interview With Eric Pines
You could also try speaking to your coworkers and asking for their support in your pursuit of reasonable accommodations. Whether or not you lodge a formal complaint with the EEOC, testimony from your coworkers related to witnessed discrimination and/or your personal job performance can be beneficial to collect. People who seek to assist individuals affected by discrimination are also protected under ADA laws.
There has been a significant improvement in disability inclusion in recent years. That said, there are still times when employers need to make reasonable accommodations for individuals with disabilities. What recourse is there for someone whose employer is unwilling to make reasonable accommodations? What do businesses still need to learn about making reasonable accommodations for disabled employees or customers? In this interview series, we are talking to lawyers, HR experts, disability advocates, business leaders, and authors about “What You Should Do If Your Employer Is Not Willing To Make Reasonable Accommodations For Your Disability.” As a part of this series, we had the pleasure of interviewing Samuel Devyver, Co-founder & CEO of EasyLlama.
Samuel Devyver is the Co-founder and CEO of EasyLlama, passionate about creating inclusive workplaces through innovative training, and is an overall SaaS swiss army knife, with experience as a three-time tech founder. He is a proud graduate of the Y Combinator, an exclusive 3-month technology startup accelerator program, alongside his brother and EasyLlama Co-founder/CTO Michaël Devyver. He currently resides in the Bay Area with his wife and children.
Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series! Before we dive in, our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your ‘backstory’ and how you ended up where you are?
EasyLlama was founded in 2019 with a mission to equip organizations with engaging workplace training that promotes a safe, inclusive, and equitable work environment for all. EasyLlama helps over 6,000 organizations train employees using course suites including Harassment & Discrimination Prevention, Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI), Data Privacy and Cybersecurity, Workplace Safety, and Ethical Practices. Our goal is to create courses that are high-quality, fun, and really different than the typical cheesy training, as well as make a real impact on employee behavior. We cater to smaller businesses as well as enterprise clients, with a self-serve option to buy licenses, and that allowed us to start very quickly.
You are a successful leader. Which three character traits do you think were most instrumental to your success? Please share a story or example for each.
I think three character traits that have been instrumental to my and EasyLlama’s success are ambition, innovation, and confidence.
When I reflect on ambition, I remember that we started EasyLlama with just a landing page and Google ads, because we knew that there were people interested in new and inclusive solutions for workplace training. We didn’t have doubts that there would be a market for EasyLlama, and we knew that no one was doing it the same way as we have, but we set ambitious goals, spent a lot of time creating new courses and we are proud to be growing fast, with profits of over 30%. We are also self-funded, and we make it a point to invest nearly all of our profits back into growing the company so we can continue to reach our ambitious goals.
For innovation, I remember choosing the workplace training industry for our next startup because we had experienced outdated training courses ourselves. Whereas some founders are trying to find a brand-new product, we wanted to innovate by finding a niche and creating a product to do things better. The Y Combinator program says “Find a 10x,” a concept for finding a good or service that you can then make ten times better than your competitors. This means that you need to study and understand the market, creating an improved service that people will appreciate. We knew we could do that with workplace training.
And finally, building a startup has also built my confidence. When you create a tech startup, it’s very hard because you never know if you’re going to make it to the next day. We believe that you aren’t successful until your clients tell you, so customer satisfaction has always been a big goal of ours. We are proud to say that our customer satisfaction score is over 90%, and that has felt like a huge accomplishment. We were confident in our product from the beginning, but it feels good to have built a product that the market finds valuable.
Can you share a story about one of your greatest work-related struggles? Can you share what you did to overcome it?
When we first launched EasyLlama we knew we wanted to have a better and brighter platform, but our competitors had an extensive library of courses — so we needed to catch up. We didn’t have doubts that there would be a market for EasyLlama, because we knew we could compete by providing mobile-first and engaging training, but we had to find a way to improve the efficiency of our course creation. We built our own software, so we don’t depend on an outside LMS and that allowed us to be a lot more creative. Knowing that we could offer a better training solution helped us overcome our struggles and we’re at a place where we are releasing courses almost weekly — exceeding our competitors’ course libraries — along with new micro-courses in 2023.
What are some of the most interesting or exciting projects you are working on now?
Most recently, we launched an entire overhaul of the EasyLlama dashboard, which makes managing an account easier, faster, and more intuitive. Everything has been redesigned from the ground up with convenience in mind, an advantage that we have over our competitors since most other training platforms do not have a custom-built LMS. In addition to features like automated training reminders, management of multiple locations, and the tracking of completion status, this redesign includes a detailed universal search, a beautiful remodel of our course library, and additional functionality to our automated course assignments.
We are also excited to be launching our Llama Bites micro-courses, which are mini-explorations of topics important for nurturing positive workplace cultures. Micro-courses, as a strategy for learning retention, have been proven effective and are used by a number of successful companies to continually nourish employee desire to grow and develop in the workplace. With topics ranging from Cultural Stereotypes and Invisible Disabilities to Juneteenth, Llama Bites will offer a little taste of something for everyone.
Fantastic. Let’s now shift to our discussion about inclusion. This may be obvious to you, but it will be helpful to spell this out. Can you articulate to our readers a few reasons why it is so essential for a business or organization to have an inclusive work culture?
At EasyLlama, we believe that it is important for companies and organizations to recognize the valuable contributions and unique life experiences that individuals with disabilities bring to the workforce, and to create an inclusive and equitable environment that supports their full participation and engagement.
Some benefits of having a diverse workplace include creating better opportunities for creativity and problem-solving and promoting innovation through the sharing of cultures and backgrounds. From a business perspective, an inclusive work environment can also reduce rates of employee turnover, and studies have shown that inclusive and diverse teams are 35% more productive and 19% more profitable.
Sadly, a high proportion of hiring decisions are made based on unconscious bias, which could result in an employer avoiding hiring someone with a disability because of a perceived notion that they may not be able to complete necessary tasks. Unconscious bias training and acknowledgment can foster an inclusive and equitable workplace by making employees more aware of their own thoughts and beliefs.
Finally, while we believe that rights to human dignity and equity are the most important reasons to provide employees with an inclusive work environment, companies must also realize the impact that discrimination of people with disabilities can have to their bottom line, with noncompliance fines ranging from $75,000-$150,000.
Can you share a few examples of ideas that were implemented at your workplace to help promote disability inclusion? Can you share with us how the work culture was impacted as a result?
As a fully remote company, EasyLlama provides our team with a flexible work schedule and generous leave time. This allows individuals with disabilities or health concerns to easily schedule appointments or clinic visits when necessary, as well as to work in the environment in which they are most comfortable. In addition, we take weekly pulse checks and quarterly in-depth surveys about how our team feels about the EasyLlama culture, well-being, and DEI efforts. Over the past two quarters, 100% of our team has responded that they agree with the statement, “I feel we are welcoming to people of different backgrounds, beliefs, and characteristics at EasyLlama.” It’s important to us that we practice what we preach, and we always put the discrimination and inclusion best practices from our courses into action with our own employees.
The Americans With Disabilities Act (ADA) requires businesses to make reasonable accommodations for people with disabilities. For the benefit of our readers, can you help explain what this looks like in practice?
Reasonable accommodations are methods of adjusting a job or work environment to fit the needs of employees with disabilities. In practice, these methods may look like providing a workspace that is in an accessible area, job restructuring (such as schedule modifications) based on needs, disability tools such as hearing or mobility aids, protected leave time for medical treatments and care similar to or identical to the Family Medical Leave Act or FMLA, providing readers and interpreters for visual- or hearing-impaired employees, or adjusting exams, training, or policies based on the disability and the employee’s needs.
Aside from what is legally required, what best practices can make a business place feel more welcoming and inclusive of people with disabilities? Please share a few examples.
There are several best practices to create a more welcoming environment for employees with disabilities, which can also help future discrimination in hiring and ongoing work experiences. We recommend engaging with community groups that support people with disabilities to identify potential candidates for your company. Some people with disabilities may be reluctant to apply for some jobs, so reaching out to them directly can have a big impact. Employers can also help prevent discrimination in hiring by including only the skills necessary in job descriptions — there’s no need to include the oft-quoted “frequent lifting or carrying of objects” requirement for most positions.
Employers can also create a space in their company where people with disabilities have a voice. They can ask employees specifically how they would like to be treated in the workplace, but keep in mind that employees with disabilities shouldn’t be made to bear the burden of doing the work of inclusion for an employer or of representing every person with a disability.
Companies can also engage employees in diversity and inclusion training to help create a healthy and safe work environment where discrimination cannot thrive. One of our latest offerings at EasyLlama is a specific course focusing on the Americans with Disabilities Act, which enables employees to better understand the purpose of the ADA in the workplace, recognize and avoid disability-based discrimination, and implement effective company policies to ensure legislative compliance.
Here is the central question of our interview. What are the best steps to take if an employee feels that reasonable accommodations are not being made to address their needs? Can you please share “five things one can do if a business is unwilling to make reasonable accommodations for their disability?”
1. First, you might try working with your employer to seek out a compromise for your reasonable accommodation. The EEOC believes that all employers want to comply with the ADA, and they offer resources to assist employers in identifying these accommodations. Keep in mind that companies do not always need to provide an exact solution to the needs of an employee with a disability, but they must offer a similar plan that works for all parties involved. In the case that an accommodation request causes the company undue hardship, they should consider finding outside funding through vocational rehabilitation agencies, tax credits, or deductions. They may also provide you, the employee, with the chance to provide your own accommodations or pay for a portion of them BEFORE denying accommodations.
2. If your employer is unwilling to compromise or has refused your reasonable accommodation, it is time to file a disability discrimination report with the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission (EEOC). In order to prevail in a disability complaint, you must show the following: (1) you are, were, or were perceived to be disabled, (2) you were qualified for your job, and (3) your employer took adverse actions against you because of your disability.
3. Working within your community to raise awareness about disability inclusion is another method to spur action in your business making reasonable accommodations. Many people are afraid to speak out or file a complaint of discrimination because of the threat of retaliation from their employers. But remember that retaliation against an employee for reporting disability discrimination or filing a complaint is illegal, and speaking out about or exercising rights related to workplace discrimination is a protected activity under the ADA.
4. You could also try speaking to your coworkers and asking for their support in your pursuit of reasonable accommodations. Whether or not you lodge a formal complaint with the EEOC, testimony from your coworkers related to witnessed discrimination and/or your personal job performance can be beneficial to collect. People who seek to assist individuals affected by discrimination are also protected under ADA laws.
5. If you are facing discrimination for your disability from a supervisor, but can speak with their higher-up or HR, you could encourage the business to conduct a company-wide diversity and inclusion training, such as the ADA course from EasyLlama. With appropriate workplace training, your organization will discover how to be more aware of discrimination and bias in the work environment, and both parties will ultimately reap the benefits of a more inclusive workforce. EasyLlama’s innovative and modern courses utilize interactive knowledge checks and real-life video scenarios to promote employee engagement and retention of information. In fact, 90% of our learners would recommend EasyLlama to their colleagues, with many claiming it’s the best workplace training they’ve ever taken.
Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share a story about how that was relevant in your own life?
I like this quote from Rupert Murdoch, the CEO of 21st Century Fox: “The world is changing very fast. Big will not beat small anymore. It will be the fast beating the slow.” We have seen this in our own company, with so much growth coming in such a short amount of time. We worked incredibly hard to release 33 courses in 2022 on top of our existing library of 130+ courses — with a goal for even more in 2023. Our small but agile team has the benefit of no “red tape” to go through like bigger companies often do, allowing us to remain committed to not letting any roadblocks get in the way of our growth. As we continue to grow, we understand the need to remain agile through strategic but fast decision-making and execution to adapt to market needs and be the most engaging training solution out there.
You are a person of significant influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. :-)
I would love to see our mission — to empower people-centered organizations to create a safe and positive workplace — expand across the globe. If there is anything that the past few years have taught us, it’s that harassment and discrimination are happening frequently, but are being swept under the rug or simply ignored. While some employers still don’t think this is an issue or something that can be changed, EasyLlama has been proven to help to change employee behavior and improve knowledge to prevent harassment. As we continue to innovate in the workplace training industry, we would love to see courses like ours inspire companies and promote safe, inclusive, and equitable workplaces for all.
How can our readers further follow your work online?
You can learn more about EasyLlama at easyllama.com, where you can also follow our articles for more information on inclusion policies, compliance laws, workplace training solutions, and more.
A few specific articles about inclusive workplaces include:
https://www.easyllama.com/blog/how-americans-with-disabilities-act-changed-lives/
https://www.easyllama.com/blog/disability-inclusion-in-the-workplace/
https://www.easyllama.com/blog/pioneers-of-change/
https://www.easyllama.com/blog/reduce-discrimination-in-the-hiring-and-interview-process/
You can also follow EasyLlama on social media.
https://twitter.com/Easy_Llama
https://www.facebook.com/easyllamatraining/
https://www.linkedin.com/company/easyllama
This was very inspiring. Thank you so much for the time you spent with this. We wish you continued success and good health!
About the Interviewer: Eric L. Pines is a nationally recognized federal employment lawyer, mediator, and attorney business coach. He represents federal employees and acts as in-house counsel for over fifty thousand federal employees through his work as a federal employee labor union representative. A formal federal employee himself, Mr. Pines began his federal employment law career as in-house counsel for AFGE Local 1923 which is in Social Security Administration’s headquarters and is the largest federal union local in the world. He presently serves as AFGE 1923’s Chief Counsel as well as in-house counsel for all FEMA bargaining unit employees and numerous Department of Defense and Veteran Affairs unions.
While he and his firm specialize in representing federal employees from all federal agencies and in reference to virtually all federal employee matters, his firm has placed special attention on representing Veteran Affairs doctors and nurses hired under the authority of Title. He and his firm have a particular passion in representing disabled federal employees with their requests for medical and religious reasonable accommodations when those accommodations are warranted under the Rehabilitation Act of 1973 (ADA). He also represents them with their requests for Federal Employee Disability Retirement (OPM) when an accommodation would not be possible.
Mr. Pines has also served as a mediator for numerous federal agencies including serving a year as the Library of Congress’ in-house EEO Mediator. He has also served as an expert witness in federal court for federal employee matters. He has also worked as an EEO technical writer drafting hundreds of Final Agency Decisions for the federal sector.
Mr. Pines’ firm is headquartered in Houston, Texas and has offices in Baltimore, Maryland and Atlanta, Georgia. His first passion is his wife and five children. He plays classical and rock guitar and enjoys playing ice hockey, running, and biking. Please visit his websites at www.pinesfederal.com and www.toughinjurylawyers.com. He can also be reached at eric@pinesfederal.com.
