Seth Avergon On The Top 5 New Marketing Trends Leaders Need To Know
An Interview With Rachel Kline
Embracing AI as a support tool, but not a crutch. AI is a wonderful support tool. It can help with ideas, structure, and get you started on a piece of content. All these are wonderful things, but don’t let it become a crutch. The information contained in AI is often incomplete, especially if you are looking to demonstrate subject matter expertise, and sometimes it is outright wrong. Learn how to use it and consider how it could positively impact your business, but never use it without a careful eye to the accuracy and completeness of the data. A few people (including an attorney or two) have already been caught over relying on AI data — don’t get yourself added to the heap of people who should have checked their data before presenting it.
Marketing trends are always changing, and it’s so important to stay relevant. What are the latest trends? How does one stay abreast of the new trends? Is it good to be an early adopter or is it best to see which trends withstand the test of time? To address these questions, in this interview series, we are talking to experienced CMOs who can share their “Top 5 New Marketing Trends That Leaders Need To Know About.” As a part of this series, I had the pleasure of interviewing Seth Avergon
Seth M. Avergon has over 25 years of experience holding key positions at Citizen, DENSO Automotive, Rain Bird, World Tableware, and RSI Home Products. His enthusiasm, leadership and creativity have been the driving force behind dozens of successful product launches and marketing campaigns. Seth is an acknowledged expert in both B2B and B2C marketing strategy, and is the recipient of numerous professional accolades, including a Trailblazer Award.
Thank you so much for doing this with us! Before we dig in, our readers would love to learn a bit more about you. Can you tell us a story about what brought you to this specific career path?
That is an interesting story. I would love to tell you I had some grand plan, but the truth is it just came together. I graduated from college with a psychology degree. My intention was to go on and study political psychology and leadership — which I began to do in my masters program. While I was there I discovered that it was not for me and switched my specializations to international law and international business with a marketing emphasis. Marketing fascinated me and tied-in extremely well with my training in psychology. It was just another way of looking at what motivates people.
From there I entered the world of business. I was very lucky and very blessed to work with some great brands and with some terrific mentors who helped me better understand how to market to different audiences. From there, my knowledge grew and I continued to promote, always continuing to learn, until I found myself in CMO roles.
It has been said that our mistakes can sometimes be our greatest teachers. Can you share a story about the funniest marketing mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?
Sure, I violated one of the first rules a mentor taught me and that was trying to be everything to everybody.
It was my first job in the real world and I was working with an import company on the east coast handling glassware, flatware, and ceramics for the U.S. market. The glassware was coming in from a joint venture partner in Mexico and on one of my trips down there I spotted some other cool products they had available for other markets. These products were outside of our core competency and were not part of the U.S. program we were handling, but they were so cool. So I launched a special order program where we would show and take orders for these products and then bring them up on an as-needed basis. It was an absolute disaster. We could not ship the product efficiently, warehousing and handling the special requests was a nightmare, Sales was confused about the program because it was outside of our normal offering. Pretty much everyone hated me for doing it.
The learning lesson was a simple one. You cannot be everything to everyone. Focus on your core competencies and build upon them. Shiny object syndrome is all too common in business, I learned early on how to ignore the shiny objects and stay focused.
None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person who you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story about that?
There have been quite a few along the way. It is hard to select just one because they all made a difference, but the 1st one that comes to mind was from a meeting I had with an SBU (strategic business unit) Director. I came in to complain about something. He stopped me halfway through my complaining and said, “Seth, if you are going to come in here with a problem I want you to also come in here with at least three possible solutions.” I never forgot that and to this day I always strive to bring alternatives to the discussion along with the issue. The final resolution might be different than what I bring, but it starts us down the path.
Are you able to identify a “tipping point” in your career when you started to see success? Did you start doing anything different? Are there takeaways or lessons that others can learn from that?
The tipping point for me came when I started getting more responsibility. Prior to that I was pretty much doing what I was told. Once I got onto a project where I had more of the reins I thought to myself “Wow, I have an impact on whether this works or not so I need to focus and do what is necessary to make sure it does succeed.” It really was that simple. The success or failure relied upon me so I took it very seriously — I wasn’t a cog in a machine, I had a direct impact on the outcome. I think the learning lesson for directors and managers is to try and give responsibility to your people as soon as you can once you feel they have the necessary skill set. It changed me overnight.
What do you think makes your company stand out? Can you share a story?
What makes AMG unique is our approach. We bring strategy and implementation together in a uniquely powerful way. Prior to starting the company (when I was on the corporate side) I had a lot of different vendors coming to me — some specialized in strategy and others specialized in tactics, but neither did both. A lot claimed they understood both, but they simply didn’t have the background or expertise to both create and implement effectively. I have a brand mantra “strategy over tactics.” That means I and my team will not spend a penny of a client’s money until there is some form of a strategy in place. No doubt, that strategy will change over time, but I always start with an objective in mind and a set of tactics that enable that objective. To just shoot from the hip tactically without a strategy in mind is wasting time, money, and manpower. Clients often come to me asking about help with a specific tactic, I always bring them back to strategy. The tactic may be the right thing to do, or it may not, a good strategy based around solid, attainable business objectives will help determine that.
Are you working on any exciting new projects now? How do you think that will help people?
I have a few fun things I am working on and I do mean fun, I love what I do. The mainstay of my business is fractional CMO roles. These are monthly retainer projects that often last years as I fill an important gap for my clients in their C-suite. However, lately I have been taking on a few advisory-only clients. These are companies that want to do the hard work of writing their own business or marketing plan and putting it into action. They may have some middle level or even senior marketing staff. They need my expertise to review the work and make recommendations to ensure success. Another thing I am working on is a seminar series. I have done a number of speaking engagements and workshops and I think the need is there for something multi-day to go deeper into the subject than I can do in a few hours.
Fantastic. Let’s now shift to the main part of our interview about Marketing Trends. As a CMO, you’re at the forefront of the marketing space and leading diverse teams. What resources or tools do you use to stay abreast of the ever-changing landscape?
The never ending quest. As a CMO, I need to be abreast of the latest and greatest to ensure I am bringing the best advice to my clients. Moreover, there is a fine line between understanding the latest in marketing and becoming too much of a proponent of a technology or trend. I need to be agnostic and choose the right tool for the right client. To stay abreast of the latest changes I stay active in a number of professional networks as well as following specific publications. We live in a wonderful time in that there is a lot of information out there, but you need to be selective. I set aside a few hours each week for learning. I think to be a good CMO you need to have a genuine curiosity for things and be a committed life-long learner — which I am. Things are always changing and you don’t need to hop on every trend that comes down the road, but you do need to understand it and how it could potentially benefit your clients.
In your experience, is it possible to forecast upcoming trends? How does this process work? Please share a story.
I am a big fan of logic tree planning. The military are experts in this and do it very well. When I was a kid I was a military cadet, and was introduced to some of this thinking By way of example — seven men parachute into an area on a mission. The sniper breaks his leg on the jump. What do you do now? Rest assured, that team has thought through how they will reorganize and still complete the mission with one man down. That kind of thinking stops organizations from making mistakes or getting blind-sided. If the people making buggy whips had played out the scenario of the growth in car ownership it would not have stopped what was coming, but it would have allowed them to prepare and possibly diversify. So while I don’t believe in forecasting trends, per se, I do believe in watching upcoming trends and doing logic tree planning of different scenarios to understand how it could impact the business and what the appropriate response would be. In this manner, if one of the scenarios does start to play itself out we already have something of a working plan in place. I once used this type of planning with a client who was considering a price reduction to increase sales. “Great,” I responded. “and what will happen once we reduce our price? How will the rest of the market and our competitors respond?” I then went about writing on a white board all of the different players in the space and their anticipated responses. By the end of the exercise, the client had reached the conclusion that a price reduction was not the right move and would create more harm than good.
In marketing, would you say it’s better to be an early adopter of trends or wait to see if they stick before allocating resources? What are the pros and cons?
I think that depends on the DNA of the organization. Some organizations are innovators and are operating in spaces with many early adopters. Their clients are looking for fresh and new things. This is often the case in technology. However, if you are in financial services, being trendy could be looked at negatively. Think of a trend as a jigsaw puzzle piece. On one side, does the piece match up with the organization — their values, mission, and vision. On the other side, does the piece fit the organization’s clients? If it is a fit on both sides then I would commit resources to doing a pilot program and seeing what results could be achieved. If not, I would hold off until such time as I find a way to make it work. The technology or trend must enable the business model — deliver a better customer experience, faster service, better communication, etc. If it does not, don’t do it.
What are some of the past trends that you embraced? What results did you see?
The trends towards more one-on-one marketing and inbound versus solely outbound marketing have proven to be powerful tools in increasing brand engagement. Historically, all a brand could do is shout a message out to the world through various mediums and hope it stuck. Now, we have the ability to engage with our audience and to cater the content to their personal preferences. I have seen brands grow engagement and increase customer lifetime value (CLV) by employing smart marketing automations that build upon the customer’s preferences and purchase history to encourage future sales. We have the ability to deliver a more personal customer experience than ever before.
Can you share a time when a strategy didn’t deliver the results you expected and what you learned from the experience?
2020 was a year of tremendous upheaval and there was no roadmap to go off of. I had brands that were doing tremendous and others that were suffering. In particular, I had one brand who was trying very hard to remain relevant but was really challenged by the market. We were trying a lot of different tactics and in retrospect, I think one of the key issues was around a pillar of that brand that very much informed the strategy. It involved how people perceived the brand and the value they placed on it and that was evolving. In this case, while the brand had value, it needed to be priced and communicated in a different way. I think the key lesson learned was that sometimes you need to go back to the very foundations of the brand and the value it brings and work it from there. This can be painful, but when the market shifts around you there are really only two choices — change or become less relevant.
What factors should leaders consider before jumping on a trend? Can you please explain what you mean?
Per my earlier response, be careful jumping onto any trend. Ask yourself a few key questions:
How does this trend align with my company values, mission, and vision?
What do my customers think of this trend?
What type of effort would be required to embrace this trend? Be specific in terms of manpower, dollars, and required time.
What would success look like if we did engage this trend? Establish an initial success measure
What financial benefit would we get from this trend? Check that benefit against the cost.
Here is the main question of our interview. We’d love for you to share your expert insight. What are the top five marketing trends leaders should know about in 2023? Can you please share a story or example for each?
Embracing AI as a support tool, but not a crutch. AI is a wonderful support tool. It can help with ideas, structure, and get you started on a piece of content. All these are wonderful things, but don’t let it become a crutch. The information contained in AI is often incomplete, especially if you are looking to demonstrate subject matter expertise, and sometimes it is outright wrong. Learn how to use it and consider how it could positively impact your business, but never use it without a careful eye to the accuracy and completeness of the data. A few people (including an attorney or two) have already been caught over relying on AI data — don’t get yourself added to the heap of people who should have checked their data before presenting it.
Continue to engage in meaningful conversations with prospects while also demonstrating expertise. Content is still king. However, demonstrating subject matter expertise while also allowing for engagement is a subtler art. It requires a bit of humility. One of the brands I work with is the clear leader in their field. They have volumes of information to educate their customers and help them make smarter decisions. But a one-sided conversation with one party showing off how smart they are is not very interesting. We worked closely to develop a social media content calendar that blends expertise with engagement. Posts that asked for opinions and input and encouraged customers to share their stories with the brand. Moreover, we kept it light. When you are good in your field you don’t need to be showy. Think of your content strategy as a relationship. Relationships where one party does all the talking don’t last very long. Engagement is all about creating a relationship, be as interested as you are interesting.
Develop drip campaigns based on behavior. Whether using a sophisticated marketing automation tool or something more basic via an email application, have pre-determined drip campaigns set up for different types of prospects. If a prospect comes in generally off of your website, have one basic drip that takes them through the features and benefits of your product or services. If they come in on promotion, ensure that the drip campaign is inline with the featured product. With one of my clients, we painstakingly identified several different engagement paths and constructed drip campaigns around each that would bring the prospect closer to a purchase. The “ask” is rarely in the first drip, but it is all leading up to that. Specific behavior, such as downloading a lead magnet, should elicit specific content that is built around the lead magnet content.
Test, test, test. As I often tell my clients, “Become comfortable being slightly uncomfortable.” At any given time, it is almost impossible to tell what messaging or offers will resonate the strongest with your target audience. You have a hunch, and that is great, but you need to test it. Test different types of digital ad copy, test several different landing pages. A/B test like there is no tomorrow and let the best ad and the best landing page win. Moreover, once you have a winner that is converting well — keep testing. Your best ad/landing page combination for September may not be the best one for October. One holiday season I struck gold with an initial digital ad campaign right out of the gate. The ad was converting and people were buying. It felt great, but I knew I was riding a wave and all waves eventually end. The team seemed confused that I wanted 2nd and 3rd versions ready to go. In 60 days, when the ad started to peter out, they understood. Keep testing. Get comfortable with the fleeting nature of things.
Market intelligence 24/7. Many organizations live in their own little bubble. They make decisions based on their needs (versus the clients) and operate in an almost pollyannaish state where what they do has no ripples effects, and everything comes out to their advantage (see my discussion on logic tree planning). The world is a complex and messy place and not everything is always as it seems. I was working with a company that suddenly had a run on a specific product. They could not keep any on the shelves. The corporate suite was buzzing with excitement. They were planning to add 2nd shifts at the factory, double the purchase orders, to air-in product if needed, anything to meet this massive and sudden demand. I asked for a few days to make some discreet inquiries prior to the new POs being placed. Via discussions with colleagues in the industry I found that one of our key competitors was having a production issue. They were out of stock and would not be back in production for 60 days. In conveying this information to executive management, I positioned the situation as more of an opportunity than a complete change in customer behavior. We needed to note all of the new customers coming in and reach out to them one at a time to see what we could do to keep their business once our competitor was back in the game. We did need some additional inventory, but not half as much as the factory had been planning for and we certainly didn’t need to air-in product and reduce our margins.
I am a big believer in market intelligence. Understanding what is happening with your competitors as well as the market as a whole is critical to the organization. As the CMO I normally take on the role of acquiring and maintaining this information. Moreover, and perhaps this is just my personal style, we are not “at war” with our competitors — people are not dying on a battlefield or going home with missing arms or legs. We are engaged in healthy competition. I have always believed in maintaining good relationships with my competitors, if for no other reason than to have a back channel available for information.
You are a person of great influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. :-)
This is something I have thought a lot about. I was pretty aimless as a child. I felt isolated and I lacked a solid sense of self. One of the key contributors to me becoming the man that I am today was my introduction to the martial arts and the philosophy that came with it. The discipline and thoughtfulness I learned via the masters I studied under made a huge impact on me and how I live my life. When I look at the world today and think about how I can give back, this is the answer. I think young men need a better code to guide them. There is a lot of confusion around what it means to be a good man and I think many of today’s youth are crying out for someone to show them a path that makes sense. A path that brings together the positive aspects of discipline and self-mastery with integrity, honesty, honor and responsibility. It is not easy to be a good man, or a good woman for that matter, especially with so much incessant chatter telling you to do this or do that. I would like to work with young men and young executives on helping them bridge that gap. To find a path forward based on the pillars of honor, integrity, compassion, wisdom and courage.
How can our readers further follow your work online?
Follow my blog: https://www.avergonmarketing.com/the-avergon-blog
Add me on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sethavergon/
Thank you so much for joining us. This was very inspirational.