Thriving As A Woman In a Male-Dominated Industry: Carla Williams Johnson, The CEO’s Publicist On The Five Things You Need To Thrive and Succeed as a Woman In a Male Dominated Industry

An Interview With Ming Zhao

See yourself as a role model. We know there’s an issue when it comes to women in the workplace and you will be met with some resistance…..just embrace it. See yourself as forging a path that other women will emulate. There will be challenges…recognize those challenges but don’t dwell on them. Use your knowledge and experience to stay focused and get ahead.

In the United States in 2022, fields such as Aircraft piloting, Agriculture, Architecture, Construction, Finance, and Information technology, are still male-dominated industries. For a woman who is working in a male-dominated environment, what exactly does it take to thrive and succeed? In this interview series, we are talking to successful women who work in a Male-Dominated Industry who can share their stories and experiences about navigating work and life as strong women in a male-dominated industry. As a part of this series, we had the distinct pleasure of interviewing Carla Williams Johnson

Carla, also known as The CEO’s Publicist helps women CEOs get into the places and spaces that increase their visibility to help them hit those income goals that they set for themselves and their business which had been previously out of reach. Her award winning company Carli Communications seeks to enhance the lives of women brand owners by giving them the support they need to build global businesses that gets them seen, heard and ultimately paid.

Thank you so much for doing this with us! Before we dig in, our readers would like to get to know you a bit more. Can you tell us a bit about your childhood “backstory”?

I was born in Trinidad & Tobago at a time when men and women had specific roles. Many women were housewives, which at the time was looked down on in terms of importance. For the women that did work out of the house they were expected to keep up with what was deemed ‘women’s work’ such as cleaning, cooking and taking care of the children.

I was one of the lucky ones, because my mother and father had a system where they would share responsibilities. Daddy would cook sometimes when mummy rested after a long day and so on. Now, while this was normal for me it was not the norm so as I grew I would be met with resistance.

I realized that men, by their very existence, opened many doors that I could never even reach…..or so I thought.

I remember being overlooked, spoken down to or outright ignored because of my gender……but truth be told I didn’t know that at the time. I just felt like I just wasn’t good enough so I kept my mouth shut most of the time, but things have changed since then and it became ok for a woman, particularly a woman of color to get seen and heard.

Can you tell us the story about what led you to this particular career path?

I remember this one time that I was working with a group of entrepreneurs to produce what was supposed to be an event that would take all our businesses ‘to the next level’.

The speaker of the event who happened to be a business coach started making demands of us which initially were fine but when she insisted that she AND HER HUSBAND (who was not a speaker but his expenses to attend the event needed to be paid as well) needed to be featured prominently to the top of the landing page, I pushed back. I stated that firstly, we compromised to place her at the top of the page granted she was not as well known to our target, and it was not her event but that she was a guest but I was totally against her husband being up there when he’s not even a featured speaker.

Her response was extremely condescending. She said: “Well if you want to have a sold out event, you’ll need to have someone white featured………it’s just how things are……if you want to make it and be successful.” Then she added “I’m just telling you what worked for me…you don’t have to do it if you don’t want to…but this is what made me successful so if you want to sell tickets you should do it. ”

So basically, the color of my skin was directly related to my success or failure rather? What’s worse, there were others who agreed with her……like this is some kind of unspoken rule that just needed to be accepted.

Well I washed my hands of that event, needless to say it never materialized, but I was determined to prove that the very thing people said would cause me to fail would be the very thing that will make me succeed!

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began your career?

When I first started my business, I would meet with potential clients at their offices regularly. Not a fan of driving, most times I would take my significant other with me……(and I would tell persons he was my driver)

Anyways while at a meeting with a gentleman, we got into a discussion about what was best for him and how he should proceed. He had gotten some bad advice before and I really didn’t want him to keep wasting money on promotional packages that weren’t working.

Now, I’m not saying that he pushed back and argued with me because I was female but he gave off this ‘know it all’ vibe and literally challenged everything I was saying……..to which my boyfriend said “Listen, Carla knows her stuff and whatever she says to do, just do it! You won’t regret it!”

Eventually I did book the client, but unfortunately his misogyny started to show and just couldn’t work with him anymore.

I learned pretty quickly that just because someone can pay for my services doesn’t mean they’re my ideal client. Sometimes I have to say no for sanity sake. I saw the signs and I still pursued thinking that my knowledge and expertise would win him over, but all it did was encourage him to comment on how my legs looked every time I had to pick up the cheque.

From then on, I always understood that it’s a relationship I’m building with clients so I have to ensure that our values are aligned.

It also occurred to me that in many cases a woman was only as good as another man says she is. After trying to convince this potential client for so long that I knew what I was doing, it was only after my boyfriend chimed in that he paid attention. Granted this particular person turned out to not be my ideal client but it stuck with me that validation from the male gender was needed in order to succeed. My goal was to change that.

You are a successful business leader. Which three character traits do you think were most instrumental to your success? Can you please share a story or example for each?

Selfishness with my time. We women tend to want to do everything and be available to everyone at all times. Setting boundaries is important if you want to get stuff done. It might sound harsh but to make it you’ve got to be selfish sometimes with your time and protect your energy.

Ignorance to the nay-sayers. The amount of people who told me that I wouldn’t make it was astounding. A Caribbean girl in Forbes….I must be crazy. Well I’ve been in Forbes….TWICE and quite a few other publications I might add. You’ve got to coat yourself in teflon and let those insults and bad vibes just slide off.

Stubbornness because some days nothing goes according to plan and it might have you questioning your very existence. You’ve got to stick with it and have a bit of patience because it takes time to find the right offer, connect with the right people and make the right decisions. It gets easier with time. My advice is to just enjoy the process.

Ok, thank you for that. Let’s now jump to the primary focus of our interview. Can you help articulate a few of the biggest obstacles or challenges you’ve had to overcome while working in a male-dominated industry?

Biggest obstacles really have been being overlooked, not listened to or taken seriously. Having my thoughts or ideas validated by a man in order to truly be recognised in the industry was real. The funny thing about it is that it happened so subtly it was kind of hard to recognize what was really happening, also coming from a Caribbean island where you were told ‘girls must be seen but not heard’ did a number on me.

I have to say, though I was very lucky that I had a genuine love and passion for marketing. When I got into the industry I was told out-right that this was a ‘white man’s world’ and maybe at the time it was but it didn’t stop me from trying.

I got my foot in the door working in the media and communications department and worked hard to build relationships and my reputation in the field…..now I’m a world renowned publicist. Just goes to show you that even if you feel there are obstacles in your way, you have to go in spite of it and greatness can be achieved,

Can you share a few of the things you have done to gain acceptance among your male peers and the general work community? What did your female co-workers do? Can you share some stories or examples?

I worked hard…….sometimes over and above to be honest. I always felt like I had to do that much more given my gender, color and, if I’m being perfectly honest, my age.

So there were times I would speak up and give my ideas on a creative project or I would approach my managers on a one on one basis to let them know what I was thinking. After a while I was given creative liberty because many clients would love my out of the box ideas, even if half the time they didn’t know who was the person working on their communications strategy (I was behind the scenes at that time and rarely ever went to meetings)

This didn’t sit well with some female employees, particularly the ones who were in a higher position than I was.

I remember this one time, I was charged with creating a communications plan for Coca Cola. It was a major promotion but it was on the verge of being canceled due to low entries..

I said to myself, this promotion is geared towards young persons and at the time there were two up and coming urban stations who would love nothing more than to be associated with an international brand, so I did two things:

1) Negotiated to have their announcers discuss the promotion during their usual morning show banter everyday for the duration of the campaign

2) Sent all the relevant information to their news department to be played during their entertainment news which was rotated on average three times per day for the duration

BOTH FOR FREE!!!!!!

Sales skyrocketed and the promotion was a success; so much so that we had two other identical and successful promotions there after.

Now, distinctly remember one of my female co-workers who didn’t love me before really started to look at me differently. I saved the promotion, the client was happy and, even though I never got the accolades the company was forever grateful.

People started recognizing me for being me.

What do you think male-oriented organizations can do to enhance their recruiting efforts to attract more women?

I think allowing women to be treated as equal is the way to go; Equal pay for equal work, but also offer incentives to help them grow and succeed.

Too often we see women vilified because they don’t have the support they need, particularly when it comes to child care. They are reprimanded if they need time off or overlooked because they are not seen as a ‘team player’ all because society expects them to work and take care of home simultaneously.

I think companies today should recognise that women can offer as much as or, in some cases, more to their role if they could get the necessary help

Ok thank you for all of that. Here is the main question of our interview. Based on your opinion and experience, what are the “Five Things You Need To Thrive and Succeed as a Woman In a Male-Dominated Industry?” (Please share a story or example for each.)

1. See yourself as a role model. We know there’s an issue when it comes to women in the workplace and you will be met with some resistance…..just embrace it. See yourself as forging a path that other women will emulate. There will be challenges…recognize those challenges but don’t dwell on them. Use your knowledge and experience to stay focused and get ahead.
2. Speak up. This isn’t the time to stay silent. Iif you’ve got a great idea or would like to add to the conversation then do so unapologetically. Let them know you’re in the room and you know what you’re talking about.The more you speak the more you’ll be heard and the harder it will be to ignore you. Ultimately you’ll earn their respect.
3. Find your supporters. Trust me, there are persons who are closer than you think who will rally behind you if necessary (some of whom might actually be men). There is power in numbers so be sure to find your community where you can lean on if you need help and can amplify your voice if necessary
4. Don’t back down. They will try to break you with tough questions or tasks that seem impossible. Keep your head up Queen and recognize it for what it is and let them know you’re not afraid…..you can get it all done. Have uncomfortable conversations and complete the projects with grace.
5. Know your worth. People will tell you that you can’t or you shouldn’t. I’ve been repeatedly told to ‘know my place’ but as the saying goes “Well Behaved Women Rarely Make History”. Understand that you belong in the room you’re in and you’re damn good at what you do.

If you had a close woman friend who came to you with a choice of entering a field that is male-dominated or female-dominated, what would you advise her? Would you advise a woman friend to start a career in a field or industry that’s traditionally been mostly men? Can you explain what you mean?

My friend can do whatever she wants. Period!

If she wants to enter an industry or start a career that’s predominantly male and she’s great at what she does then by all means she should do it. Nothing should stop us women from doing what we want to do.

I can tell you that I did it; Even when they told me I was the wrong color, the wrong gender and that only ‘white men’ succeed in this line of business. I silenced them all and have gone on to achieve great things such as being mentioned in Forbes (twice), talking on international platforms and helping women around the globe.

Have you seen things change for women working in male-dominated industries, over the past ten years? How do you anticipate that it might improve in the future? Can you please explain what you mean?

I love how women have collectively decided that they are going to be heard and they are passing these traits down to their children. I also love that there are men out here who are our allies and create spaces and platforms for us. I only see things getting better from here on out.

We are very blessed that some very prominent names in Business, VC funding, Sports, and Entertainment read this column. Is there a person in the world, or in the US with whom you would love to have a private breakfast or lunch with, and why? He or she might just see this if we tag them.

I’d love to have lunch with Rachel Rodgers. Read her book and I think what she’s doing for women entrepreneurs is amazing.

Thank you for these fantastic insights. We greatly appreciate the time you spent on this.