Interview with Designer Mateusz Król
A discussion covering video mapping technologies, creativity under quarantine and national mythologies and their place in society.
crossing domains: Maybe a good place start would be for you to introduce yourself and your artistic practice, why you studied at the Polish Japanese and what you’re graduating with?
Mateusz Król: My history with the Polish-Japanese (PJAIT) actually started with me not getting into the Academy of Fine Arts, Warsaw and their Media Arts Department. So I thought ok, I will study one year at PJAIT and I will try once again. But then I realised that the Polish-Japanese isn’t bad and I liked it there. I started discovering new people, new approaches and especially new medias that I can create and use. In the first year (because before I had no idea what I wanted to do) I discovered some approaches in animation and I wanted to carry on doing something in this area.
cd: So this is the reason you decided to stay at PJAIT?
MK: Yes, in the first year and the amount of things that we learnt — comparing to the Academy of Fine Arts — there was a big difference. I knew much more than my friends from the Academy. Of course they knew some other things that I did not know, but I liked what I learnt here. It was a good decision to stay.
cd: I’m glad to hear it, so what are you working on now that you’re in your final year?
MK: I’m working on my diploma which I will present in September, given the situation. It consists of a video clip of a Polish song called Autoportret Witkacego by Jacek, Kaczmarski and Przemysław Gintrowski. It’s a classic song that was famous in the 80's, it was more well known in the intelligentsia and opposition circles because the authors were very creative by using different analogies from mythologies, the bible, etc to share their views. It’s full of hidden meanings. Through this I realised that it wasn’t know by everyone, and not understood by everyone.
cd: So how does video mapping and motion design come into play with this audio clip? Are you combining the two?
MK: No, there is no video mapping. Video mapping is something I like to make but I enjoy doing many different things.
cd: Ah ok, so let’s talk about your Quarantine Mapping project and why you did it.
MK: The idea was very simple, I wanted to stay creative during lockdown and had all the equipment borrowed from PJAIT and because of the popular #stayathome I wanted to use it to get some people to see my work. The positive thing about doing something in the kitchen and not projecting it in front of a huge crowd was that I could use the music that I wanted. It’s about energy and I wanted it to be appealing with its colours and speed.
cd: So how would you define yourself as a designer? Are you a graphic designer, an animator…? Which industry would you most closely associate yourself with?
MK: I would like to balance this because first of all I would like to create things which can entertain people like video mapping, which can be for huge crowds and commercial things. I would be very happy to create things for people don’t have the inside knowledge of design and arts, something that would entertain them and convey a message. Take video mapping, which is usually an entertainment for kids, and the plot is usually something to do with history of a building. Nowadays I see a lot of video mapping that is boring and looks the same, I want to try and make them more interesting.
Secondly I want to create light installations that can be placed in say, a Museum of Modern Art. This could be difficult though because I’m not associated with this environment, yet.
cd: Yet is the fundamental word! Let’s take the majority of modern art, now, which has a very, very social and political context and meaning. So a lot of the times contemporary art is dealing with those contexts and agendas. Do you think that video mapping, or these technologies and mediums that you use, have a social function in the future? In terms of peeling back histories in a critical way, or making objects speak?
MK: Of course I see a future with these technologies as they’re used now. Sometimes I think their comments are too literal. I believe it’s very important to balance it when it’s a political thing. When it gathers lots of people there needs to be clear, literal and smart messages. But there are also topics that are sometimes a little bit unknown and it doesn’t gather a big crowd. I believe this topic demands a more ambitious way to present, something more metaphorical, something that is not literal.
cd: So working with these technologies to create a metaphorical way of dealing with say, social and political issues. If you look at the shows that have been at the Museum of Modern Art in Warsaw and at the Ujazdowski Castle, both are heavily political and place art and design as commenters on these issues. But also responding to them as well and not just passively commenting on them. I was wondering if you see a future for your practice once you’ve done your masters at PJAIT in Poland? The reason I ask this question is because I moved here from the Netherlands and everyone always asks me “why have you moved to Poland?”
So I was wondering how you feel about this? Do you feel there is hope for your artistic and design practice in the coming years in Poland?
MK: Firstly I would like to refer to the question that many Poles ask you “why are you here?” I don’t like this question, I would ask you “what aspects of this culture are interesting for you?” Our political situation is sometimes difficult, I understand that some designers and artists do not see a future here (not only of course artists). I always ask myself if everyone exits Poland, everyone ambitious, everyone who wants to do something good for society, who will be left in these difficult times?
I would like to of course go abroad to learn new things but I would like to always come back here because I like it here. Something will have to be after this [political] party, it will not rule for the entirety of time; something will have to be after that and I believe my generation will be play an important role in building aPoland after PiS.
cd: How much do you think your education at PJAIT helps you with this “Poland after PiS”? I’m wondering because University education is very formative and it helps crystallise ideas, and I want to get a feeling of your experience as student of how PJAIT builds communities and bridges with other cultures. How do you feel about your experience at the Polish-Japanese in terms of things like that?
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MK: In our department there are lectures which really help to increase our ability to interrogate things, like lectures about what happens in our public space. For example, when we have a lecture about history of animation or film we always talk about the meaning behind it, why it was used, what the time was like when this animation or film was created. Everyone is asked us to think about it and have comments on the subject. We also have lectures in philosophy and psychology of communication. I personally care about these lectures and the assignments that we have. I always find that they are very good for our understanding the world: questioning and doubting many things, doubt is very important.
cd: Skepticism and questioning is something that should be fundamental in education processes, and not to take things at face value. I think this is what design teaches you to do, inherently. To dig deeper and look at the mechanics and see what connects to what, and why that is. This should play an integral part of how any country, or any society, after some kind of trauma: like Poland after PiS and the UK after Brexit.
This all being said, what’s the topic of your thesis?
MK: It’s about national mythologies because they are something many human beings base their views on. People of course believe in them and think about them. For many it’s a way of living. I speak personally about national mythologies because I’m interested in history. Every country of course has it’s own national mythologies. For me one of the most important phrases about the subject is from the philosopher and sociologist dr. Tomasz Kowalczuk: “National mythologies are created to teach the young to fight in war”.
cd: Mythologies are fascinating! I’m researching speculative and critical design from a Polish/Slavic perspective, how to create tangible narratives that are rooted in the popular consciousness, aren’t weaponised by the right, but can be used by the left. And to then really work with these mythologies of a specific people to actually build a counter to the nationalist narrative that’s becoming very popular across Europe.
MK: The reason I started to research this subject was because there was term used by politicians that became popular: historical politics. I have many doubts in it, it makes me a little bit afraid. This phrase was very popular among our politicians.
cd: Do you think you’ll carry on this research into your Masters degree?
MK: You know, I have no idea right now. But I’ll try and find another subject to explore that has been unspoken until this moment and try to make it popular.
Mateusz Król is a third-year New Media Arts student at the Polish-Japanese Academy of Information Technology. He specialises in motion design, especially video mapping. His interests include painting, photography, history and politics.
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