How a late night of studying rope physics inspired an indie game developer to reinvent America’s favorite pastime, but fun.
An interview with the brilliantly playful developer of the indie game, Baseball But Fun
“I love everything about baseball except sitting through it. I want to make baseball fun.”
Baseball, But Fun is a chaotic, barebones, baseball-bat-swinging roguelike that highlights the talent of Jamerson, who is a brilliantly playful game developer who has taken the aesthetic of baseball and turned it into a game unlike anything I’ve played before. The demo for Baseball, But Fun was released on August 24th, 2021 and even though it is still in it’s very early stages of development, it is clear to me that Jamerson has created something that holds a lot of promise to be something that is truly special. I recently had the opportunity to sit down with Jamerson just before he released the demo (which is out now!) to hear his story, inspirations, and what his beef with baseball is. It was an extremely refreshing conversation about the trials and errors of game development, the iterative nature of creating art, and the story of how a night of experimenting with rope physics led him to begin on the somewhat controversial journey of reinventing America’s favorite past time, but fun.
I’ve done my best to accurately write our conversation here for you to enjoy.
Saturday, August 14th, 2021–8:02PM PST
B: Have you ever been interviewed before?
J: I have not! This is a first for me, I’m not sure what to expect to be honest.
B: Well let’s start with something easy then. I’ve been looking at your Twitter handle for while now, trying to figure out what it means. What is @JMRSNH?
J: Haha! It’s actually just my name, Jamerson, capitalized and without the vowels in an attempt to keep my real name not ‘out there.’
B: How long have you been making games?
J: I've been doing this for two years now! It’s something I had been wanting to do for a long time. I was kind of familiar with Unity, using it for some 3D modeling stuff in the past, but then I ended up hearing about Gamemaker Studio and it seemed pretty easy to get started. Once I started getting into it, I started really getting into it. Every bit of programming I know has been learned over the past two years. I haven’t taken any formal classes, I’ve tried really hard to learn as much of the ins and outs as I can by myself. It’s actually led to me start studying game design in school and am fully jumping into it next semester.
B: That’s awesome! Hearing about some previous experience in Unity, experience, did you start doing art for games before jumping into the programming side?
J: I’ve been drawing for forever, but jumped into digital drawing about three years ago. I ended up going into game development after practicing some programming with my brother, who is in Computer Science. He introduced me to that world and helped give me the ability to start making games myself. Now I could apply the aesthetic things I love about games by myself.
B: What are some of your biggest inspirations?
J: One game that has been the most inspirational for me and is in the back of my mind whenever I start a project is Rain World. That game has some of the best procedural animation I’ve ever seen and is filled with these creatures that are so imaginative and feel legitimately alive. Which is what I love the most about it and is what I am always aiming for in my projects; legitimate feeling procedural animation. What I really set out to do is to capture a feeling. I had started to work on an RPG game with a frog as the protagonist, trying really hard to make the world feel alive and lived in. In Rain World, things interact with each other and everything feels like it belongs. Another game that captures that spirit is Dark Souls. It feels like a legitimate world because all of the little details that come together.
B: Yes, everything feels very intentional.
J: Exactly. Another one that is super inspirational is Vlambeer’s Nuclear Throne. I am not very good at it and although I have put over 100 hours into it I have still never beaten it. *laughs* Every time I get to the throne I get just so nervous and die. I am honestly just really bad at a lot of video games.
B: *laughs* Well you been really bad at any video games recently?
J: Actually, not really. Since I’ve started making games almost all of my extra time goes into game development. The last few games that I’ve really enjoyed that is somewhat recent is Ultrakill, which has some super satisfying game mechanics. Especially all the small details in the movement that can reall affect how well you do. There is also Cruelty Squad. Which is a really strange stealth retro-shooter game. It is horrible to look at, but I loved it. The only other one I have played recently at all is Hollow Knight, which is another world that felt alive and was super inspirational to me.
B: In your own words, how would you describe Baseball, But Fun (BBF)?
J: I am not sure how best to describe it, but I think the best way I can describe it would be comparing it to playing a room in a game like The Binding of Isaac or Nuclear Throne over and over. It’s a wave-based, bullet hell-ish game without those nice patterns that you see in bullet hells that you can weave through. Maybe the best way to describe it would be a wave-based semi-bullet hell? It’s not super evident in the demo, but I plan on adding roguelike or arcade elements in the coming updates. Something like the different ships in Galaga. All of my previous projects have been these really expansive and ambitious ideas that I don’t think I really have the experience for. I feel like with BBF this has been the most confident I have ever felt during a project. When I released the Handdogg demo, I felt like I was a fake. It was the first time I had done anything like that [released a game]. It was the first thing I ever had anyone else play something I had made. Baseball But Fun is a big stepping point for me. I hope it will be received well. The gameplay gif I tweeted out for the announcement got a lot of attention so I do feel a little bit like, ‘Oh God, I hope no one is expecting anything big.’ Because right now all you do is fight waves and there are only three enemies in it. I plan on adding a ton to it, but the demo right now is a really good base moving forward into a full release.
B: How did you start working on BBF?
J: What is started with was thinking about rope physics in games, or specifically I was thinking about — well I had worked on Handdogg for a while, then I stopped. I took a big break, but I was trying to get back into it. I was sitting there thinking about how the mechanics of having ropes wrap around things in games work. I had started researching ropes and had heard about Verlet integration, which is important to how some people simulate ropes, and that led me down a rabbit hole with these games that have really realistic looking physics for objects that are super unexpected. What I found was that having ropes that look and feel really nice aren’t even that expensive, even though they look super good, are realistic looking, and add a lot of detail. What I mean by expensive is like in terms of processing the effect. After the rope episode I looked into water physics and how people make 2D water physics and I went down that rabbit hole. I was looking up how someone would be able to apply what I was reading to Gamemaker Studio in the sorta pseudo-3D space that I was working in. Something I am a huge fan of is fake-perspective and fake-3D spaces in a 2D environment. I was trying to figure out how to do it and I started by making just cubes, not in a baseball diamond or anything, just cubes. I made it so that when I clicked they would bounce up and down and it was amazing. I was like I am a genius! I’ve done the impossible!
B: *laughs* That’s a good feeling, yeah.
J: From there I had to try and figure out how to make these amazing cubes into a game. I added a little dude that could run around, so then I thought what environment could he could be running around in, and then I drew some grass for the tiles, then put the grass tiles into a diamond and thought that it looked quite a bit like a baseball diamond, so I added bases and — I guess where I am headed is that I got Baseball But Fun to where it is by a series of random decisions that ended up working out surprisingly well for me. Step by step I kept getting little pieces that fit really well together and through a series of random decisions and pushing them all into a direction that felt right I ended up making Baseball, But Fun.
B: How long has BBF been in development?
J: It’ll be a month tomorrow. During this time, it has been literally the most productive I’ve ever been on a project. I’ve been the most consistent and felt the most proud of my work than I ever have been. I feel really focused and have really enjoyed it. Right now I feel completely in my element. I’ve quickly made some decisions, which seem almost random, and it’s worked out really good. As nervous as I am to release it, it is also the most excited I have been to release something, which is something that I have never felt before. Which has also been a huge driving force in my productivity. It’s like, I am proud of myself and so I can easily keep putting forth the effort because I have enjoyed working on it so much.
B: That’s beautiful man. Poetry. I’m glad to hear that.
B: What made you choose the name Baseball, But Fun? Not a fan of baseball?
J: I have pros and cons with baseball. I think that the people who play baseball are very talented. Being able to hit that small of a ball traveling 90 mph with a tiny little bat across a field is incredibly impressive, but… you can’t tell me that there aren’t long waiting periods during baseball where there are a lot of people that are just kind of standing around not doing much. With that in mind, I think that the aesthetics and everything around baseball are really interesting. The design of the uniforms, how every stadium is different, or how far back the history goes, it’s all really fascinating. At the same time it is pretty well known for being the most boring sport out there compared to football, soccer, or basketball. I was originally thinking of calling it Baseball++ or Super Baseball, but I thought you know what, I’m going to go with my bold idea, and what I really think of baseball. I think it paid off, or that it will pay off, people seem to really like it.
B: I think it’s hilarious. I think whoever sees your title is left in a spot of like, “Okay, well let’s see what you got.” Because first off, you’ve dissed the entire sport of baseball, and second, you’ve thrown off my expectations and I wanna see what you got, cause it better be good. *laughs*
J: *laughs* To be honest, I was kinda scared that baseball fans would get mad about it, and some did! There were a handful of replies that were snarky about it, but I was like, ‘Alright, I asked for this, I should expect it.” I thought about throwing in like #baseball in the announcement tweet, but in the end I thought better of it. I might have got just one too many baseball fans upset about it.
B: *laughs* Yeah, that’s asking for it. That’s like tweeting: “sharks suck #sharkweek” You’re probably gonna get some mad shark week fans in your replies.
J: That’s actually my next game, Sharks, But Interesting dropping next shark week.
B&J: *Laughs*
J: But really, I love everything about Baseball, except sitting through it. It can be a little bit boring. I really wanna play off the themes and culture around baseball and incorporate it into the game. I want to make baseball fun.
B: What is your relationship with social media? It seems like you got a pretty big reaction to your gameplay gifs of Baseball But Fun. Is it a positive thing? Or is it more of a necessary evil?
J: What gets me, is getting to see peoples reaction to it. Every time I get more than like twenty likes on Twitter I get like so obsessed. It annoys my girlfriend so much because I am constantly checking my phone and showing her like, “Oooooh, look who replied!” When I had first started out I was super nervous, and I always felt like I wasn’t doing anything right. Whenever someone starts out it can be hard to get any attention on your tweets. It’s actually really hard to get anything out there, so I’d get super nervous any time I tweeted anything. Anytime someone would like one of my tweets I’d freak out over it and check out their entire profile. I didn’t know anyone when I first started, and it took some time, but eventually I met a couple people through Twitter and now I have a group of mutuals that are super inspiring to me and are constantly keeping me motivated and excited to keep working on my stuff. I just look at their stuff and go, “Man, I gotta get back into Gamemaker, I gotta start working again!”
B: That’s awesome!
J: Thanks, yeah! My relationship with social media went form this nervous place where I felt obligated to post things, to becoming my way of seeing what my friends and mutuals are working on and getting inspiration for things. It’s become more of a positive thing, and every time [a tweet]does well, and I am getting a bunch of feedback and replies, and I get to see how people react, it’s really nice. I’d say that being able to interact with my mutuals in that way has been the best part of social media.
B: What’re some of your goals with game development?
J: I want to do it for a living one day, eventually. As much as I get nervous about the idea of working at a big studio. There are a couple of studios where you can tell the developers are really just in love with the work and I think the games they release are a reflective of that environment. I think the best example of that would be Dishonored. It’s a game I can replay and replay and it always feels just as good because it is a world where you can tell the game developers really cared about it. I’ve always dreamed of working at Arkane Studios. If I got to work on something I really enjoy like that, then I think I’d love to work for a studio. If I couldn’t work for a studio I think I’d love to work in a collective, like Sokpop, who does monthly games. That would be an absolute dream, yeah. That would be the best.
B: I hear you man. I love the Sokpop guys. I don’t think anyone is doing sustainable indie development better than they are. Dishonored is probably one of my favorite games of all time, I have no idea how they made such a magical game. It’s actually incredible. You’re talking about the first one right?
J: Yes. I like the second one too, I’ve played the first half of Dishonored 2 so many times though. What I’ll do is play the first half then get distracted by other stuff for a few months, and then come back to it and restart it from the beginning. I’ve played through the first Dishonored I don’t even know how many times. Dishonored came out when I was like twelve and it made me soooo edgy. Obviously twelve years old is a very impressionable age, but I remember thinking like, I wanna be a thief, I wanna be in a Victorian rat city…
B: I wanna see whalers…
J: I wanna be marked by the Outsider!
B&J: *Laughter*
B: I know what you mean though. I remember day dreaming about how cool it would be to have that Blink ability.
B: Looking through your Twitter I see that you have posted gameplay gifs of Handdogg, an untitled Frog RPG game, and now BBF, are these all current projects, like are they all currently in development?
J: No. I am mostly picking up and putting down projects right now. In the back of my mind I have this hope I’ll come back to these games at some point, but the issue with that is, when you have someone who is as new to this whole thing as I am, and you are learning and growing and changing techniques and style as often as I am, it can be hard to actually ever do that. Because as you grow and learn more, you will have to change techniques and style, right? When I think back to the Frog RPG game I was working on, I definitely worked way harder than I needed to at certain parts because I didn’t know the different work-arounds that I know now. I overcomplicated things, or simply did them poorly to begin with, and that means that if I were to go back, I’d be spending time re-doing things that I have already done, when I would rather work on new things. I feel like this is super common in hobbyist game developers. It’s basically that as you learn and grow, your old projects become outdated faster than someone who has the experience, the skill level, and has found a consistent style. There are so many different skills that a hobbyist game developer has to learn, it all takes a lot of time. As much as I love those older projects of mine, I know that I’d want to remake those projects almost from scratch, and that would be a bigger undertaking then what I want to do, if that makes sense. Where as now, with BBF, I feel very confident in the foundation of my game. I know that I have the skill level to work on it and continue working on it. I haven’t had any issues that I haven’t been able to overcome on my own. It’s really exciting for me because I feel like I can finally make the game that I want to confidently.
B: What’s your approach to making games? Like how do you start?
J: I’m very big on adding a feature and then polishing it as much as I can before touching anything else. Like every single feature has been one after another. I’ve never been good at having ‘basic’ or placeholder versions for things that will be left to be done ‘right’ later. Like I will make the controls and player character fully done with weapons and everything before even implementing the first enemies. It makes it feel more complete and polished to me. Now that I have a solid foundation for BBF, it makes me very excited to keep working on it.
B: With your games do you do everything, are you a solo developer?
J: Yes, well almost. I do everything except for the music. All of the programming, design, and art are done by me. My brother is doing the music for Baseball, Is Fun, which is the first time we’ve worked together on something. We’ve always wanted to work on a project together and we’re finally going to on this one, it’s very exciting.
B: Are we going to get to hear a chiptune Take Me Out To The Ball Game from your brother?
J: *laughs* I’m not sure. They did just send me something that is titled ‘Chiptune Sports Organ Music Synthwave’.
B: F*** yeah. That’s what I’m talking about baby!
B: Working as pretty much a solo developer do you ever get burnt out? I know you’ve mentioned wanting to potentially work at a studio or an indie collective, what’s behind that?
J: I have a few different reasons. First, it would be nice to have someone working alongside me to bounce ideas off of, to help test the game, and come up with additional ideas. I know I have shortcomings and it’d be nice to be able to have someone fill in those gaps. I’ve never been able to work with someone on a project before and my brother is the only one who has ever helped me playtest. Second, just having the work be a group effort would just be really nice. There are pros to being a solo developer, but it’d be nice to share the load. That’s why the dream would be something like a small collaborative group in the vein as Sokpop.
B: That makes sense. In your opinion what is the biggest pro to being a solo developer?
J: Well, I get to make all the decisions, but that’s not always a pro. *laughs* I think the fact I can put my all into a project and because it was all done by myself, the result will be completely me. I feel I can work on something and have the satisfaction of figuring it out on my own. When I think of it, I think the biggest pro is my very familiar workflow. Since I just work with myself I know how everything is going to fit together and I have gotten really good at working with myself. *laughs*
B: Well I think that is all I have for you. I just want to thank you very much for taking the time to sit down and talk with me. It’s been a pleasure.
J: Thank you. It’s been a real joy. It’s the first time I've been able to do an interview and its been awesome and really fun.
B: Any closing thoughts, statements? Anything you’d like to stay?
J: If I were to say anything it’d be about the title. I love the title and stand by the title being both good and true. Everything is good about baseball, except sitting through it.
B&J: *laughs*
Since our conversation, the demo for Baseball, But Fun has been released. You can play it here: https://jmrsn.itch.io/baseball-but-fun
In closing,
I really enjoyed sitting down and talking with Jamerson and have since played several hours of Baseball But Fun and I can confirm, it is indeed very fun. Thank you for reading this interview. If you want to follow Jamerson or myself on Twitter you can here:
Jamerson: https://twitter.com/JMRSNH
Me (Brady): https://twitter.com/pezomi
Until next time,
-Brady
Bonus question:
B: Just curious, have you ever played baseball?
J: I have never played baseball, the closest I ever got was with my friend in our neighborhood. I was batting and he pitched it and I hit it once and it went about five feet, but I screamed out “YEEEEESSSSS” it was great. I’m really glad I didn’t hit it too hard though, as I probably would have broken a window.
B: Have you ever been to a professional game?
J: I’ve been to just one. I saw the Nationals play in DC and honestly, I had zero expectations and thought it’d be kind of boring, but I went and I had such a blast! It’s a lot different being there than like on TV.
B: It’s always good being at a game. I just enjoy being out there.
J: Yeah! That’s why I’m making a baseball themed game, even though I don’t play it and haven’t ever super followed it, I still think baseball has such of an interesting culture and aesthetic around it.
