An interview with Russ Maschmeyer
From designer to design manager, then product designer to co-founder — we asked Russ about his leadership styles and how design leaders can ask for help.
Russ first spoke at Leading Design London in 2017 where he shared some big lessons he learnt making the transition from designer to manager and back again; lessons about what a manager is, why you should (or shouldn’t) become one and how leadership comes in many forms.
Two years has past since Russ spoke and a fair amount has changed. He’s now the co-founder of Primer — an app that allows you to see paint colors on your wall instantly and find the perfect hue!
We caught up with him for a little chat.
In your LD talk you mentioned you made the mistake too many new leaders make. You didn’t seek mentorship or guidance until it was almost too late. How can design leaders feel open and confident to ask for help (without feeling they are underperforming)?
Russ: We often think of asking for help as a “break glass in case of emergency” option. Instead we should think of it more like yoga. It’s a healthy practice worth building a habit of. Seek advice and support every time you feel unsure of how to proceed. When you’re in a new role or expanding your responsibilities this will likely happen every day. Even after you’ve grown into your role there will still be things each week worth seeking help on.
To make this a habit, you first have to learn to recognize that nervous feeling you get in your gut when you aren’t sure what to do. Give the source of that feeling a name, write it down, and find a peer you trust to share it with. As you share, ideate together a few concrete ways you might handle it and feel out which course seems best. If you leave that conversation still unsure of what to do, bring those thoughts to your manager to seek their advice at your next 1:1 (or ping them if it’s more urgent). Even if you feel sure of what to do, it doesn’t hurt to share what you’re facing and how you plan to tackle it with your manager. They may have advice or insights you might not have thought to ask for.
As a manager, I guarantee that if a member of my team articulated an issue they’re facing having already considered how to respond, I’d not only be happy to offer my 2¢, I’d be really impressed by their thoughtfulness and proactivity. When this behavior becomes a habit your learning and trajectory in your role are going to hockey-stick and your team and manager will notice.
I want to pause here and recognize that sadly not all organizations are open and supportive. You may work in a culture where you have to project success and confidence constantly. If you truly feel like asking for advice will compromise you then I’d recommend seeking a new opportunity if at all possible. If that’s not an option, you should seek advice and support from the community outside your company.
You were the manager of Search and Profile, then a product designer at Civic Engagement at Facebook. How does the leadership style differ now that you are a founder of a company?
Russ: The role is certainly different, but I don’t think my style of leadership has dramatically changed. I’m not type-A. I’m introverted and don’t enjoy handing out tasks or building roadmaps, so I’ve had to develop a somewhat unusual style that feels more natural to me. Generally that means making lots of room for other voices. I’m more likely to ask what you think before I offer my own point of view.
I love the process of ideating and creating a compelling long-term vision and I love building a compelling narrative, but I’m constantly feeling out the right next steps vs. building and sticking dogmatically to a detailed roadmap from point A to point B. I prefer to give teams the agency to make their own drive their roadmap. I spend a lot of time thinking so that when I do offer a thought or suggestion it’s worthwhile and considered.
I’m sure there are philosophies and behaviors unique to Facebook leadership styles that are less natural to me that I’ll shed over time. I think I’ll have more perspective on that in a few years. I learned a lot while I was there and there are undoubtedly going to be things I need to un-learn.
How has your experience at Facebook influenced decisions made in building Primer?
Russ: Facebook had a direct impact on what I chose to build next. One of the reasons I got so excited to build Primer is that it’s a digital product in service of real-world value. Interactions with friends and loved ones on Facebook are valuable, but at the end of the day Facebook’s value is determined by how much time people spend staring at a screen and how much they invest in their presence and connections in a virtual network.
When I set out to start something new, I got excited about digital products in service of real-world value. If Primer is successful it’s because we helped people build better homes for themselves and their loved ones. There are so many tangible outcomes to a product like that. Technology is just the enabler.
Primer is a vastly smaller company in comparison to facebook, (therefore might not have as many senior leaders). If a design leader is the most senior at their company and needs support, how do they seek it?
Russ: A conference like Leading Design is a great place to connect with folks who have been through whatever you’re experiencing and come out the other side. If you can’t make it to a conference like LD or if you live somewhere where you can’t share physical presence with other design leaders, the next best thing is to connect with peers and leaders you respect on Twitter. You’d be amazed how many would gladly give you a few minutes of their time if you reach out with a respectful DM or email (including me!).
Whether you look inside or outside your company for support, find someone just ahead of you on the leadership path. If you just started managing, a Chief Design Officer at a large company is going to have less time and relevant advice to offer you than someone who has been managing for a year or two. Seek out someone who is likely to have dealt with your concern in recent history.
What is the most common question designers ask you? And why do think people are still asking?
Russ: The most common question I get asked is “What’s it like being a first time (designer) founder?” People are always curious about that leap. My immediate answer is that it is a roller coaster of emotion. I’ve heard people talk about this before and I was like “Yeah, I get it. The highs will be really high and lows will be really low. Whatever.” But it’s real real.
You spend a lot of your time at one end of the spectrum or the other. Your confidence changes at least every day and sometimes multiple times per day. It is wild and managing your outlook and mood so that it doesn’t derail what needs doing takes restraint and support from people you love. Sometimes you just have to go to bed feeling like a failure, hoping you’ll have renewed energy in the morning. On the other hand, sometimes things go really right and there’s no better feeling in the world! It’s so important to celebrate those moments.
The second most common question I get asked is “You have kids, how do you work-life balance?” Honestly having kids helps more than it hurts. It’s a forcing function. In the early days of Primer as I was adjusting to being the pace-setter for the company I had a hard time being present with my family. I’d constantly be checking my phone, thinking about the business, trying to squeeze in a few more minutes on my laptop, but it was making me totally miserable. I couldn’t really be present with my family nor could I get anything meaningful done without the ability to focus.
I realized that when my mind and my body aren’t in the same place I can’t be happy. So no I work on Primer with 100% of my being from 9:30am to 5:00pm every weekday. At night and on weekends I shut it down and just spend time with my family. It took some work to get there. At first I had put physical distance between myself and my phone. The temptation to take it out to check in was just too great.
You can’t always stop my mind from wandering, but you can make a choice not to feed the anxiety by trying to get something done outside work hours. It’s an ongoing effort but it has made a big difference.
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