Interview with Jason Mesut

In advance of the Leading Design conference in London on the 24th-26th October, I caught up with Jason Mesut to discuss his background, experience and thoughts on the subject of Design Leadership.

Tell us about your first design leadership role? Who did you model yourself on?

The first design leadership role that I can remember was when I took over a project at Oyster Partners (now DigitasLBi). I was in charge of leading the design for a health product called the Map of Medicine and I had a team of visual designers and user experience architects working with me to iterate the existing solution and create new solutions. I had to give direction to the team and review their work, while also giving them the space to come up with some fresh thinking.

I’ve never really modelled myself on one individual, but I have learned many different things from those that I have worked with. I learned the power of presence mixed with a little self-deprecation from Jon Hughes at PA Consulting, the need to have fun with the team from Warren Hutchinson (whom I worked with several times), the motherly side of management from Julie Kennedy (at Yell), and the importance of giving people your time to listen when you need it no matter how busy you are from Chris Boulter at RMA Consulting.

What does a typical day look like for you? Is it all meetings?

Not any more, but most times when I was a manager or leader it used to be, yes. I had to discipline my time to do work first thing and at the end of the day, or on one specific day of the week (eg, Tuesday) and just deal with the reality that the rest of the time, the meetings and workshops were valuable time for me to spend with my team or the wider team.

Do you still get to do any “real” design?

Yes, now I do more. But in a few roles previously as a manager this was really hard. In an agency or consultancy environment, there were times when the most ‘design’ I did was a slide deck presentation or proposal. These are still artefacts of communication for me and can really shape whole projects or relationships, so they are still important. However, I would make sure there were opportunities in working sessions for me to better express my ideas — at least on paper or on whiteboard. I just struggled to find the time to do any real zoning out into the design work.

What are the qualities of a good design leader?

That is a big question with many different answers from different perspectives

Here is a small answer from my perspective

• Humility — someone who knows where they are weak and where they are strong
• Passion — someone who really cares about the work and the team
• Drive — someone who will push for the right thing for the team or the work
• Resilience — someone who can protect the team against the shit, and can deal with the shit from the team
• Skilled — I personally feel like it helps as a leader (as opposed to a manager) to be able to do a lot of the work and for the team to respect the abilities of their leader, so a good design leader for me can impress those around them

What challenges are you facing at the moment and what are you doing to overcome them?

I am having some problems with communication with remote and part time team members who are talented, but also very opinionated, and work in different ways to what I am used to. It’s hard for me to estimate the time they may spend on something and still be happy with the outputs. Setting expectations and clarifying these helps, and we do try to address any issues as soon as possible. Letting them build up is a recipe for disaster.

What are you most proud of achieving as a design leader?

There’s rarely one thing, but I have always been motivated by seeing others who I manage or lead succeed. Many of the people I have managed or led have become very successful in other organisations.

I remember being incredibly proud when one of my team members presented her work at a conference and getting really good feedback from the audience. I felt prouder about that than I ever have of my own work or presentations. It was the time when I realised that I wanted to be a manager and a leader, as I had helped nudge her into that situation and supported her through that work.

Any advice for a new design leader?

You really have to want to do it. You have to think beyond yourself and recognise that it isn’t an opportunity for you to shine brighter through your direct work. You gain by helping others and letting them make a few different turns (or mistakes) themselves. If you steer in the right ways (that’s the tough part), they will hopefully do things that will blow your mind and can accelerate their career. But, you really have to want to do it. And you mustn’t begrudge your new responsibilities — just find ways to continue being a designer and doing design. That means making time for you to design as well as making time for the team.

Anything else on your mind at the moment?

I’m thinking a lot about how collective models of different senior talent coming together can work effectively. There are often different approaches and experiences. And lots of opinions. On short projects, or in the early stages, it’s hard to establish the right way of working and who is really leading. I’m not a fan of overly structured patterns of working (eg, google design sprints) but I appreciate it can help with this. The challenge more than anything is that with senior, talented folk, those differences of opinion and approach can cause conflict. Conflict is often necessary, but resolving it is still always hard for me.