“How to Create a Fantastic Work Culture” An Interview with Phil Geldart

Phil Geldart, founder and Chief Executive Officer of Eagle’s Flight, is a recognized authority in the areas of transforming organizational culture and leadership development. He pioneered experiential learning in the training and development industry, his company is now a leader in that field. He has created numerous experiential learning programs which are now used around the world and translated into over two dozen languages. Phil is a powerful speaker he is the, author of seven insightful books in areas crucial to performance improvement, such as leadership, teamwork, experiential learning and culture transformation and he is a recognized thought leader in the area of releasing human potential. Prior to his current leadership role at Eagle’s Flight, he was an executive with Nestlé Canada.

Can you tell us a story about what brought you to this specific career path?

In my early years, I did quite a bit of work with youth, particularly in the camping environment. I not only taught life skills but also canoeing, water sports, and many of the other things which you pass on to campers in a camp setting.

When I went into industry, I seemed to naturally gravitate toward the training field, as I enjoy teaching people and had had some experience with that through the camping experience. I also felt that I could improve on my university experience, which was not very satisfying from a learning perspective, as the lecture format seemed to me to be neither very effective, nor particularly interesting.

Consequently, when I became the person responsible for training in the company, I introduced games into the learning environment. Those games masked the principles that I wanted to teach so that participants could first play the games, and then through a structured debrief, learn from their experiences in the game. I felt this “learning by doing” would be far more effective than simply them listening to me teach, and, as it turned out, this approach was remarkably effective, and engaging.

From that insight, I started a training company whose key point of difference was experiential learning. However, along the way, I had also learned the importance of making sure that the training actually changed behavior and improved performance. As a result, that became the second major point of difference from for the company, that is, to provide training which actually improved performance. So, what started out as a way to pay off my mortgage grew into a global organization.

I never actually set out to be an entrepreneur or run a company. It just evolved that way, and as the number of clients continued to grow and with that, the business, so did my role as the leader.

Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you began leading your company?

The company started out by selling experiential learning games, which I believed was the best way to help people better understand the things they wanted to learn. It turned out that these games were remarkably effective, engaging, and compelling, far beyond anything I had foreseen.

The most amazing thing for me since I began leading the company has been going into a client meeting and having them remember something they learned from one of our games 15 years ago. It’s generally hard enough to remember what you heard last month, let alone 15 years ago!

I recall sitting in an office when the individual we were speaking with reached over to their desk and handed me a summary card they had received after going through one of our experiential learning games many, many years ago. They said that not only have they kept that card as a reminder, but they could still remember to this day the key principles and learnings from that experience, and were still applying them.

It never ceases to amaze me that the power of learning by doing, and learning through experiential activities, can be so impactful; and to realize that something created so many years ago has made such a sustained impact on so many people.

Are you working on any exciting projects now? How do you think that will help people?

For many years, the work that we did was focused around people getting together in classrooms, being able to physically work and be together. This was essential given the nature of experiential learning, and the fact that people learn best by doing and interacting.

However, as today’s world migrates to a more global economy, with people often being widely separated from one another, and relying heavily on digital technology, the challenge exists to replicate the same experience that they have in the classroom in a virtual world.

We have just created what I hope will be the first digital learning tool that will go beyond knowledge transfer and actually impact behavioral change. Its goal is to improve business acumen and productivity in the workforce, and to do so with the same impact as we achieve in the classroom.

The reason this is so exciting is that it brings the entire world of experiential learning into the digital space, but it also allows for tools such as apps to be integrated into that learning. Then, after the experience, the learning can be summarized and taken away in an app, for application to their day- to- day jobs.

It’s truly exciting to be able to think about linking the power of experiential learning with digital technology, so that individuals can not only learn on their own time, but they can actually acquire tools and practices which will be able to influence their daily decisions in a significant and dramatic way.

According to this study cited in Forbes, more than half of the U.S. workforce is unhappy. Why do you think that number is so high?

My own experience has taught me that the key influencer of performance, as well as job satisfaction, and “happiness”, in the workplace is very largely dependent on the quality of leadership within the company. This leadership falls into two categories.

The first category is the leadership provided at the most senior level by those who create the culture in which people work. The workplace environment can be one that is either conducive to creativity, imagination, and the promoting of individual strengths, or it can be the opposite of that and even toxic.

When the environment is such that individuals feel that they can flourish and excel, and live in a situation where they are free to contribute and not be fearful about making mistakes on the journey to excellence, their job brings greater personal satisfaction.

The second area of leadership is that provided by the immediate supervisor. When my leader engages with me, respects me, values my opinion, and is committed to my growth, then I have a great opportunity to flourish and be “happy“.

I don’t think we can underestimate the influence of the immediate supervisor not only on performance, but also on the well-being and job satisfaction experienced by each individual.

Based on your experience or research, how do you think an unhappy workforce will impact a) company productivity, as well as b) company employee health and wellbeing?

When we think about the workforce as being either “happy” or “unhappy”, I think we need to look beyond the idea of happiness to the concept of fulfillment. If, as an individual, I feel fulfilled, and I am given an opportunity to contribute to my fullest and that contribution is recognized, I can be said to be “happy” or “content” or “satisfied” in the workplace.

It’s important to realize that it’s not just about each individual, but it’s also about their colleagues. When the other individuals with whom I work feel similarly engaged and empowered because they are also receiving great leadership, then my work environment is a reflection not only of the way in which I am personally being led, but also the way in which we are all lead.

When these situations exist, then I am able to contribute to my fullest, bring ideas forward, make suggestions, and show initiative. I am also provided with coaching and guidance so that I can improve and grow,; and I feel secure in the knowledge that my immediate supervisor is committed not only to my personal growth, but also to showing me how to be maximally productive.

In addition, great leadership also provides extensive clarity around what is important, relative priorities, why things are being done, and the rationale for decisions. When I have this degree of insight into the organization, and clarity of mandate and accountability, then I am able to focus my own effort and attention on what is most important for the well-being of the organization.

When you take all these things into account: the way in which I am led, the freedom I have to contribute, the clarity I have around direction, and my own clear sense of accountability, then a number of things occur. I optimize the company’s profitability, I am performing at my own optimal level of productivity, and my sense of self- satisfaction and well-being is maximized. The byproducts of this are that employees tend to stay with the organization, intellectual experience and knowledge is not lost, and team performance accelerates.

Can you share five things that managers and executives should be doing to improve their company work culture? Can you give a personal story or example for each?

Five things that leaders should be doing to improve the company’s culture would be as follows.

1. Value input. One of the most valuable resources within any company are the ideas, suggestions, and experiences of the workforce. When those charged with making decisions begin by seeking input from those who have experience with in the area being tackled, or who are going to be charged with implementing the decision, then performance is optimized. A key component of a great culture has just been demonstrated.

As an example, I was recently creating a new way to bring learning to a digital world, and came up with an idea which I thought would be really effective. Rather than simply moving to implementation, I pulled together 10 people whose opinions I strongly valued. Over the course of an hour, they came up with two pages of additional suggestions which, in their incorporation, would make the idea radically more effective.

Recognizing that this level of contribution was possible not only improved the idea, but gave the participants a sense of ownership, and will give the company a significant advantage when we bring the product to market.

2. Focus on accountability. Very often, individuals confuse activity with productivity. In a culture where productivity is key, then, clearly defined accountabilities are essential. Not only must the accountabilities be defined, but each individual needs to be held responsible for delivering on those accountabilities, and not confusing “best efforts”, and “trying hard” with actually achieving the promised outcomes.

As an example, I once had a sales manager who was unable to distinguish the activity of making sales from the productivity of helping others make sales. As an individual contributor, the sales manager was exceptional, but when it came to leading the team, they were unable to translate their own personal sense of accountability for results to those that they led.

Their default was always to go out and personally make sales to make up any sales shortfall, rather than equip others to do so. They never really fully understood that their accountability in the new role was very different from their accountability in their previous role, and as such, were unable to fully optimize their performance as a sales manager.

3. Manage change well. To create a truly productive culture, and one in which people feel fully engaged and “safe”, leaders need to be able to manage change brilliantly. While there are a number of things which must occur in order to effectively lead through transitional times, the one that is most important is to consistently and frequently communicate the rationale for the change, and the accompanying actions being taken.

For example, in the early stages of our company, the priority was to drive the creation of powerful products into the marketplace to meet customer demand. The next priority was to create awareness within the marketplace of our capability and product portfolio. The third priority then became to optimize those products, and that client base, for maximum profitability.

These three major changes in corporate focus needed to be communicated well and frequently to the organization so that they were able to stay in lockstep with the evolution of the company, and so contribute to the highest degree possible.

When this clarity is not provided well, and consistently, then the workforce tends to feel that they are out of sync with what is going on, they do not understand why things are occurring as they are, and they are unable to contribute to their fullest. This then results in a culture where people feel disconnected and uninvolved, as opposed to one where people are excited about new horizons and what the future will bring.

4. Coach. Leaders need to be able to pass their strengths on to those that are looking to them for help, and guidance. They need to consistently be mindful of the fact that those they lead are looking to grow, take on more responsibility, and to do so in a way that is contributing to the greatest possible degree of success in the organization.

As a result, the responsibility that leaders bear for coaching, guiding, and helping others is significant. When they do it well, the culture flourishes, and when they do it poorly, or not at all, then the culture suffers.

A number of years ago, one of our best people came to me and indicated that he felt he could grow if he were given the opportunity and the appropriate coaching. It then became a priority to invest in that person, and to give him additional skills and the opportunity to develop. Over time, he became one of our most significant contributors within the organization, and an executive able to influence significantly throughout his client base.

Without his willingness to learn, and without a coach with the skill and desire to teach him, that potential would never been realized, and the company would have been far less successful in the marketplace, and not have the impact that it came to have as a result of his contributions.

5. Provide feedback frequently. The gift of feedback can be very effective. Individuals who want to improve, but are attempting to do so in a vacuum, when appropriate feedback is not provided, have a great deal of difficulty in achieving their full potential. Feedback is a way in which leaders are able to direct the initiative and contributions of others. A feedback- rich culture is one in which performance excellence flourishes.

Feedback must be done in the moment, while the issues are still fresh, and done with kindness, tact, and courtesy. The objective of feedback is to strengthen and guide, not demean or belittle. Consequently, the feedback needs to be honest, but also presented in a way that is both esteeming and constructive.

One of the best examples of this is a requirement that sales presentations for major clients be rehearsed, and that those delivering content in the classroom rehearse before doing so. It is this rehearsal in a safe environment, in front of those with considerable skill and expertise, that results in the best possible outcome. Presenters are able to practice their content and get feedback throughout the rehearsal.

They are able to master the various elements of the presentation in front of an audience who is supportive and helpful, but also before a group who has committed to provide feedback to enhance the overall result. This focus on rehearsal and the accompanying feedback enables the presenter to then go forward with confidence, and to be as effective as possible. It also goes a long way towards building a culture of excellence, and one in which individuals feel that they can thrive and flourish.

It’s very nice to suggest ideas, but it seems like we have to “change the culture regarding work culture”. What can we do as a society to make a broader change in the U.S. workforce’s work culture?

To make a broader change in the workforce culture, there has to be a much greater appreciation for the power of leadership, and the expectations of leadership. In today’s world, leaders need to be committed to releasing the potential that resides in each individual that they lead. They need to understand that there is great ability in every human being and learn to both unlock and harness that potential.

Critical to this is a widespread need to address the character of a leader. Leaders need to speak with integrity, have a high standard of personal professionalism, and hold themselves to account in terms of their own performance, decisions, and judgments made.

If we want to see the workplace culture change, we need to establish leaders who can demonstrate that they are able to respect individuals, and give them maximum opportunity to perform. They must themselves be willing to be seen as an example of what they expect from those working for them to be or become.

How would you describe your leadership or management style? Can you give us a few examples?

I think my management style is one that is based on three words: teachability, integrity, and accountability.

It’s very important that individuals be truly teachable; that is, that they are willing to learn and then apply the things which they’ve learned. Having this quality, when they are exposed to new ideas and concepts, or coaching, or development, they embrace the new learnings and flourish as a result. This allows them to operate more independently, and with greater freedom of action.

Integrity is important because it means the people will do what they say they will do. They can be relied upon to deliver on the things which they have committed to achieve and to behave in a way that is genuine, authentic, and trustworthy. Those others with whom they work feel as though the work culture is one of trust and mutual support; as a result, all individuals can flourish within their jobs.

Accountability speaks to the need to achieve what’s been committed. With it, individuals take initiative, look for ways to solve problems, seek advice, search out new ways of doing things and best practices, and are continually focused on delivering an outcome, as opposed to simply “trying hard”.

When we take these three things into account, and they become the hallmarks of each individual being led, then leading becomes far more straightforward. Consequently, I tend to encourage my own people to focus on those three areas so that I, in turn, can then help them achieve the things to which they’re committed.

I think the best example of this would be to look at the leadership team that has grown up and developed over the years within the company, and to see the degree to which they are operating independently, and able to make decisions and take actions which previously only I could do. They have understood how and where their growth has come from and so are doing the same thing with their own direct subordinates, building into them in the same way that they themselves were developed.

Someone once told me that the mark of a great leader is the caliber of leaders that they leave behind when they move on, and I think that is a great test for a leader’s capability, and something that I constantly aspire to be good at.

None of us are able to achieve success without some help along the way. Is there a particular person whom you are grateful towards who helped get you to where you are? Can you share a story about that?

I worked for a number of years for a truly superb leader. He was not only outstandingly committed to the well-being of each person that he led, but he was also very aggressively focused on delivering on his own accountabilities of corporate growth and profitability. He essentially demonstrated, in one person, a compassion for people, and a conviction around the importance of performance.

Because of these two capabilities, I was able to observe true leadership in action that included both “the “what”, that is the responsibility to the shareholder, and “the how”, that is the value and respect for each individual.

I found myself often asking him how he did things, or why he did them, so that I could learn and replicate that in my own leadership style. I don’t think he saw himself as a teacher, or coach in the classical sense, but he always took the time to answer my questions in a way that I could go away and apply what he said. From that input, I was able to personally grow, and to do so within an environment where performance excellence was required, acknowledged, encouraged, and recognized.

I think it would be very difficult to underestimate the influence of working for a leader of that caliber. Not only did I learn a great deal from him, but I also learned the importance of leadership from him, and the need to be as effective in the lives of the people that I was leading as he was in mine — ; and to be as focused on the results expected of me as he demonstrated daily.

How have you used your success to bring goodness to the world?

One of the key priorities of the company I lead is to make a difference in the lives of others. I think the nature of the business that I’ve chosen to be in, and the impact it has on the lives of so many, is an important priority. It’s important not only to me, but also to the people within the company.

We are fully committed not to simply providing learning, or training, or information, or education. Rather, we are committed to making a difference in the life of every individual we touch. Sometimes, that difference is made through leaders as we equip them to lead others more effectively, and sometimes, it is made directly in the lives of the people that we are working with or responsible for influencing. Either way, the impact we make on the lives of others is a key priority.

Interestingly, not only does a strong culture and a productive environment improve corporate performance, but it also improves the quality of life for each individual working in that environment. It allows them to have a balanced work and home life, to operate in an environment without unnecessary stress, and to have a sense of satisfaction for a large portion of the day when they are at work, and engaged in their chosen profession.

The ripple effect from influencing lives in this fashion is significant, as personal growth and capability cascades throughout the lives of all those they touch. Equipping individuals and leaders to value others, respect human dignity, appreciate the words of each individual, and release potential makes a significant impact in both the companies in which those individuals work and in the world in which they live.

Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you show how that was relevant to you in your life?

One of my favorite business-related quotes is: “To understand all things is to forgive all things.” I think it’s important to recognize that our view of the world is not the only view, and that others may have a totally different perspective on many issues.

As individuals go through life, their experiences, environment, and context shapes their thinking and opinions. When we begin to work together, their attitudes, thoughts, and approaches may be very different from mine, and it is crucial that I not operate only from my own perspective, but that I also try to see issues from theirs.

I may not agree with what they are saying, and I may not approve of their perspective, but I can try to understand it, and from that understanding, attempt to respect their perspective; and then interact with an appreciation of their viewpoint of the things we are discussing, or the world in which we live.

You are a person of great influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger.

An understanding that there is within every human being immeasurable worth, and unimaginable potential. Yet, that potential may remain untapped unless it is recognized and nurtured by someone who can guide, teach, and lead. I would equip leaders to see beyond their functional responsibilities to see what is possible when they unleash the potential of their employees. After all, contributing to the release of that potential is the role and privilege of anyone in a leadership role.