I Interviewed Lady Gaga and This Is What She Taught Me
Gaga showed me the power of vulnerability.
I interviewed Lady Gaga in 2014 while she promoted her №1 jazz album, Cheek to Cheek, with Tony Bennett. 48 hours prior to our chat, my now ex-boyfriend and I had just broken up.
Gaga gave me some words of wisdom, and it changed my life.
I’m Jordan Miller, the founder of BreatheHeavy.com, a Britney Spears fan-site turned pop music news community. Gaga saw the value in BreatheHeavy— she wanted fans of pop music to pay attention to jazz, a genre she calls the original form of pop music. Gaga’s longtime manager, Bobby Campbell, connected Gaga and me in what became a career milestone.
“I’m very happy to talk to you on BreatheHeavy.com because this is a pop website, and I really want to express to all of the young people that visit your site that jazz once was the pop music of America,” Gaga told me. “These are the most famous pop songs in the whole world. They have been done over and over and over again. I appreciate you taking this time for the interview because I really want to expose young fans as much as I can to jazz. It is something that healed my soul at a young age, and I hope they love it as much as I do.”
We spoke for just under 20 minutes in 2014, but the sincerity in her voice, the honesty in her replies, has stayed with me all these years. Gaga opened up to me, so I opened up to her, telling her I had a roller-coaster week but talking to her was helping.
“Well, good! I’m glad I could help make your roller coaster go up,” she said.
The conversation shifted back to jazz, a genre she resonated with more in her formative years than the otherworldly pop goddess we’re familiar with now.
“When I moved to Los Angeles, the music became much more dance-focused because the publishers were really excited about this young, quirky New York song-writer who was making these sort of electro-clash influence dance songs,” Gaga told me.
“Once ‘Just Dance’ took off, I didn’t do anything but put my head down and get to work, and I never looked back. After many years of doing that, I began to really burn out. I mentioned many times to people around me how I needed to slow down, how I needed more time to be creative, to spend more time and focus honing in my craft, build myself as a vocalist, continuing to study as a musician. You don’t just learn about music in the beginning and then you’re set for life. You’re constantly learning. I was feeling as though I couldn’t continue to grow because I was just on this endless money-making machine.”
She added: “What’s been so wonderful with Cheek to Cheek is I get to return to my roots. I started singing jazz when I was 13.”
For all intents and purposes, jazz saved her. As I wrestled with my own depths of despair, I realized music was my savior, too. I let my walls down and told her I just went through a breakup.
“It means so much to me… thank you for sharing that story with me. Your personal story,” Gaga said, before offering some life-changing words:
“That’s a sign of a great interviewer… [someone] who can be vulnerable.”
Little did Gaga know those words inspired my journey into discovering what vulnerability is and how to harness it.
When one of the world’s most interviewed people on the planet tells you a sign of greatness is vulnerability, you listen. However, expressing and harnessing this emotion requires immense commitment to personal development.
I shared my heartbreak with Gaga, and she shared it back.
During that era, Gaga performed a cover of “Bang Bang (My Baby Shot Me Down).” She explained to me why that performance was so heartfelt.
“An interesting backstory for ‘Bang Bang’ is that my ex-boyfriend, Lüc Carl, was also the best friend of Brian Newman (the trumpet player who she plays that song with). We haven’t seen or spoken to [Luc] in almost two years, so that performance is extremely emotional for us,” Gaga said. “It was a romance, a goodbye… extremely painful. I think that’s what makes the performance very honest. You have his ex-girlfriend and his ex-best friend playing to one another, and there was something that was quite heart-wrenching about it for both of us.”
It felt as if Gaga and I were two friends catching up over a casual cup of coffee. I sipped each and every word like a strong cold brew on a morning commute to Chromatica.
Practicing the art of being vulnerable is a daunting task. It requires your mind to stretch past its safety precautions. Your thoughts traverse into unfamiliar territory where ridicule and doubt reign supreme. However, the act of intentionally putting yourself in situations that require vulnerability cultivates inner strength, which manifests profound and often life-changing circumstances.
Gaga’s art of vulnerability is masterful. She shed light on another side of herself that I didn’t expect: her journey with sobriety.
“I have not shied away from being honest about struggling with needing to drink or taking drugs since I was a young 19-year-old girl,” Gaga said. “I have found my sobriety through my relationship with Tony Bennett because he helped me to heal through singing these songs. I could probably get through ‘Lush Life’ when we were singing it, but he just told me to breathe and allow the story to come through in the music. That way, you can no longer beat yourself up about your weaknesses. Your weaknesses become your triumphs.”
I asked if she’s worried she’ll lose her “sobriety” when she begins to focus more on pop music again.
“No, not at all! I think it’s a daily struggle for anyone that has gone through this sort of thing. And, I’m not entirely sober. I am practicing meditation and self-control.”
I currently live a sober life. For the record, this marks the first instance I’m sharing that side of myself. This is me being visibly vulnerable.
Gaga continued:
“I am very focused on my career. I feel like it’s ‘The Fame’ all over again. I have that hunger in my belly, especially since this is a new genre for me. It’s almost like it’s putting out my first record. I want to make Tony so proud, and I certainly will continue to write pop songs. I consider jazz to be pop.”
She adds:
“Fear not! It is not the music that controls my expression of my solitude. It is me, and I feel very happy with my loneliness. My solitude is something that strengthens my art. I’ve embraced it. I feel very liberated, very happy. Like a tiger let out of the cage, or a bird flying for the first time, in a long time. Maybe like the Phoenix. My wings aren’t broken anymore.”
This rebirth was years in the making, but at the time I sensed it’s something she only recently realized.
Gaga recently revealed she and Tony Bennett have a follow-up jazz album out this spring. It marks one of Bennett’s final projects as he continues his battle with Alzheimer’s disease.
Being vulnerable is hard. There’s no guarantee the observer will grasp the emotion’s magnitude but does that matter? Those who intentionally act vulnerable reap the rewards.
Dr. Brené Brown, who’s extensively researched what it means to be vulnerable, said it best:
“The difficult thing is that vulnerability is the first thing I look for in you and the last thing I’m willing to show you. In you, it’s courage and daring. In me, it’s weakness.”
In the time since, I’ve struggled with finding the balance between oversharing and being professional. Say too much on the Internet and it’s used against you, say too little and you’re anonymous. If Goldy Locks stumbled her way through the window to your soul, what bowl of vulnerability porridge would she sample?
For me, it boils down to this:
Showcase your emotions to others in a way that intentionally scoots you out of your comfort zone, but not so far where you’re out of alignment. Purposefully share your thoughts and feelings with those willing to listen so that not only are the people around you inspired, but you are as well.
Your vulnerability shines a bright light onto others in the hopes that they’ll reflect it back. Your vulnerability can change the world. Our world.
“I’ve worked hard towards this moment, and I think it’s an important message to tell my fans: even if you’re going through a dark time… don’t ever give up,” Gaga said towards the end of our time together.
She concluded, “You can always make your way back to the other end of that circle and find your happiness again.”
