CoffeeJack misleading crowdfunding claims or worse a scam?
CoffeeJack a small hydraulic device for making espresso, currently being crowdfunded with misleading claims.
If you just want the drinks and not the work, then do what I do and pop out to a local cafe and someone else can deal with it all. — James Hoffman
Originally crowdfunded on kickstarter, then even though target reached, switched to indiegogo to raise more money.
Also a price hike
- £73 or 2x £130 — kickstarter
- £75 2x £140 — indiegogo
Claims price will double, buy now, offer will end, but no dates given, thus marketing hype to pull the punters in. And this offer has been running for months.
Stated delivery has not been met. At end of June was showing May 2020. Not been shipped by June 2020. By end of June 2020, not shipped and then stating September-October 2020. July changed again to October 2020. At a guess lucky if see before Christmas, if see at all.
The following claims
- no electricity required
- no pods or filters required
- cafe quality coffee
misleading and irrelevant.
How to heat the water? If no electricity, on a gas flame, on a bonfire?
No pods or filter required. True, but irrelevant.
Cafe quality, a low bar to achieve.
Coffee that can be made with CoffeeJack, only cannot. It is not possible to make for example a flat white or cappuccino as would require a steam wand.
Cafe quality coffee.
Not exactly a selling point, cafe quality coffee.
A cafe with a cheap machine, coffee ground who knows when, no skilled baristas, cheapest commodity coffee can get away with.
It was then claimed on social media comparison with top flight espresso machine. When asked to name the machine, refused.
Meaningless comparisons.
There are many ways of making coffee. Illustrated are different methods, these are not espresso machines, thus to claim do not achieve 9–10 bars when none claim they do, is not only meaningless and misleading it is dishonest. It is like comparing apples with oranges.
Why not add cold drip?
Another meaningless irrelevant comparison, the money saved not going to a coffee shop.
I enjoy visiting a coffee shop, the ambience, the conversation and of course the coffee.
I would not replicate any of that at home.
Nor would I have takeaway. A good coffee sit and relax and enjoy served in glass or ceramic. Though in a covid-19 world that would be some time into the future.
Espresso is the main brewing method for professional coffee shops/baristas as it can be made into any coffee variety and is richest in flavour.
Simply not true. For the very best coffee would choose V60 or Chemex or maybe use Gina, but would not have as espresso. Nor can an espresso make a filter coffee, to give but one example.
No cannot be used to make all these coffees.
James Hoffman:
Espresso is probably the most intolerant of any food or drink preparation in the world. This is not an understatement. A few seconds outside of the target brew time, a gram of ground coffee too little in the basket, a few grams too little liquid in the cup — all of these will have a dramatic effect on the taste of the coffee and may be the difference between a delightful cup and pouring the result of your hard work down the sink.
No one has had hands on experience. Refused to let experienced baristas have hands on as prototype only. And yet apparently handed to Vogue and GQ, well known coffee journals I think not. Not even Cereal. Or were they handed a device or a picture?
The exposure in Vogue if can call it that, a postage stamp size mention in the back pages of Vogue. A joke. In reality more or less word-for-word regurgitation of crowdfunding hype and appears to be paid advertising masquerading as Vogue recommendation.
No one allowed hands on and yet claimed feedback from backers. How, how is this possible when no one has had hands on experience?
Nine bars is required to produce espresso. Too little and the pressure insufficient to force water through the coffee resulting in under extraction and weak espresso. Too high and the coffee in the basket will compress, water will not pass through, again resulting in under extraction.
When asked how is the nine bars maintained, refused to answer. When asked evidence of nine bars, for example measurement with a pressure meter, refused to answer, refused to provide evidence.
Questions are not answered, or vague evasive meaningless answers which simply demonstrate lack of understanding of coffee.
CoffeeJack requires less than 10 pumps directly over your mug/glass.
A video was uploaded to answer questions, only it did not, it begged yet more questions. It showed 18 pumps of the device to achieve the claimed nine bars, the crowdfunding claimed less than ten. Nor was it as implied, a new video uploaded to answer questions, it was posted on youtube December 2019.
We do not see the arm so no means of guessing the force applied.
I would not wish to be pushing down on my expensive coffee cup.
As an afterthought, a stand has been added as an optional extra.
Boro-silicate glass. What if dropped, a hairline fracture, pressure builds up, then explodes, shards of glass near boiling point hot liquid, does not bear thinking about.
Meaningless. 16g dose in the basket, but what is the extraction? On facebook in response to a question they claimed 16g was extracted, which begs the question from what? But we see here, the other way around 16g dose in the basket (and no not 16G). Begs the question the weight of espresso extracted. With 2:1 as the useful ballpark, 18g dose would give 36g of espresso. But what was the grind, the temperature, the coffee, the extraction rate, was the extraction rate measure with a spectrometer, time? Again refusal to answer.
And that is par for the course, questions are not answered.
I would love to cite my questions and the meaningless answers, but I cannot, my questions have been deleted, I am blocked, and scrolling through comments on facebook, critical questions from others have also been deleted.
Crowd funding promotional video once again illustrates lack of knowledge of coffee, ground coffee measured with a scoop not weighed, the beans disgusting oily black over-roasted beans from which no self-respecting lover of coffee would make espresso as the only taste would be of burnt coffee beans.
Ballpark for an espresso
- 18g dose in the basket
- 36g espresso
- 27–29 seconds
- 12% extraction
Ballpark 18g, would then fine adjust to set the grind for best extraction. A task a barista performs every morning, and during the day as temperature and humidity varies. Dialing in an art in itself.
A visit to The Speciality Coffee Shop before lockdown Michelangelo had spent several hours the night before until he was satisfied with the espresso he asked me to try.
No mention cannot make espresso with tap water. Can try but it would taste awful. I have tried. At the very least would require bottled spring water or a Peak filter jug. Or maybe ask very nicely a coffee shop to sell water.
At the inaugural Brighton Coffee Festival last year I tried an espresso made with tap water followed by Barista Water. An amazing difference. One undrinkable, the other a delight to drink.
I am no great fan of espresso, I find too harsh too strong, I prefer a V60, but occasionally with an exceptional coffee, as with Michelangelo at The Speciality Coffee Shop or the Brighton Coffee Festival, I will find I enjoy.
The pricing of CoffeeJack varies depending upon where look.
- £75 — indiegogo crowdfunding
- £99.95 was £149.95 — facebook shop
£75 pushing it. No way £100. And the £150 is a completely fake price.
For comparison 9Barista £300, double the price of the alleged price facebook shop for CoffeeJack.
Fake prices, misleading claims, something Trading Standards and ASA should look at and if necessary prosecute.
Look at the alternatives and save money
- V60 … £25
- Chemex … £40
- Aeropress … £27
- Japanese siphon … £100
- Gina … 130 euros / 220 euros
- Nespresso machine less than £100
Prices may vary. Check with your local coffee shop. They may well give you a bag of coffee if ask nicely. V60 ceramic, plastic will cost a fiver or less, Pact Coffee are giving away free with a subscription and can cancel subscription after first bag of coffee arrives. Coffeelink throw in a free bag of specialty coffee when purchase an Aeropress. There are cheap clones of the Hario Japanese siphon for around £30. Two prices for Gina, identical but for addition of a digital scale built into the base connects to phone app via bluetooth.
Nespresso? Many will query why include Nespressoand rightly so. Does not Nespresso produce undrinkable coffee? Yes and no. If use Nespresso capsules yes, vile undrinkable espresso. But a well set up Nespresso machine with third party capsules produces amazing espresso. And that from a 60 euros Nespresso machine, though it was Panama Geisha roasted by The Underdog. Internally the machines are the same, paying more for external appearance and addition of gadgets and gizmos.
We are left with asking the obvious question, is it a scam? I do not know, but increasing it looks like a scam when misleading claims are made, failure to deliver, refusal to answer questions, deletion of critical questions on social media which they refuse to answer.
Indiegogo should investigate and in the meantime suspend from their site.
I have asked questions, not got straight answers, then for daring to ask questions, blocked, asked to evaluate, refused to supply a working prototype.
I leave a last word from James Hoffman and I paraphrase. If unknown company, crowdfunded, unrealistic claims, then red flags are flying.
That is not to say there are not successful crowdfunded coffee projects, Gina, Niche Zero, Peak water filter, but these are by people with experience and understanding of coffee, something very much lacking with CoffeeJack.
Is it possible to make espresso without the traditional espresso machine? Yes, a fourth crowdfunded coffee project, 9Barista, designed by jet engine designer William Playford, and oh what a difference, solid, nickel-plated brass, and professional, designed by someone who clearly knows about coffee.
More expensive than CoffeeJack, in the same price range as a cheap domestic espresso machine, but maybe worth paying the extra.
The professionalism shines through not only in the design, but also the advice on coffee, grinder, the need for scales to accurately measure the coffee, extraction ratio, time. None of which is mentioned with CoffeeJack, and when ask, either refuse to answer or get meaningless reply.
And the big difference, 9Barista manufactured in the UK not offshore and available now.
China is engaged in brutal repression in Hong Kong. Do not buy products made in China. CoffeeJack is manufactured in China.
If wish for a manual espresso machine then consider Rok EspressoGC espresso machine.
Rok like CoffeeJack relies on mechanical advantage, the difference CoffeeJack hydraulic, Rok EspressoGC lever.
The other big difference, Rok well made, a track record and can buy now.
The price of the Rok, no different to the artificial fake price CoffeeJack shown for facebook shop. Given a choice, it would be Rok every time.
Is CoffeeJack a scam? If not a scam, the very least lack of knowledge of coffee which casts doubt on the project.
If it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then most likely it is a duck.
I would caution I have not had hands on, but not for lack of trying, but then neither has anyone else. Their refusal to let anyone with experience of coffee have hands on should in itself send out a very strong warning.
There seems to be no end to this scam.
September 2020, Facebook comments now angry comments, fools easily parted from their money have had enough, demanding a refund.
If you are one of these gullible fools parted from their money, post a comment demanding refund with ten days. If no refund forthcoming claim against credit card, also complain to Facebook, Kickstarter, Indiegogo to have the scam taken down
October was the latest of the deliver schedules. Mid-October and still no delivery. But to add insult to injury and beggars belief, now added an on-line CoffeeJack Store, maybe in anticipation of being taken down elsewhere, and taking pre-orders. Same garbage as before, claiming many different coffees, which no it cannot make, same images showing coffee being made with dark over roasted beans. Price now £94.00 with artificial inflated fake price £162.00, to make look like a bargain. Links to non-existent pages. And no indication of delivery. On Indiegogo still claiming delivery October 2020.
December 2020, since my last update, now showing delivery of May 2021, has bene showing for the last couple of months. Sill making the same incredulous claims. I can only repeat my advice from earlier update, if one of those gullible fools their money easily parted, please post on Facebook a demand for your money to be refunded within ten days. If no refund, ask Kickstarter and Indiegogo remove this scam (CoffeeJack probably set up an on-line store in anticipation), and if paid by credit card then try to obtain a refund via that route.
As both Kickstarter and Indiegogo profit from these scams they should have a fund that reimburses participants on their platforms who fall victim to these scams.
