Lee Maicon: Without the audience, there’s no story.

I recently had the chance to sit down with Lee Maicon to get his perspective on a range of topics, from Patagonia and research to clients, and client relationships. Ah, and we also got to speak about what he thinks is his legacy (so far) in this industry.

Today, Lee is the Chief Strategy Officer at The Community. Before, Lee had been the Chief Strategy & Innovation Officer at Edelman, and the Chief Strategy Officer at McCann North America. From 2010 to 2018 Lee led an industry-leading insights and strategy team at 360i, known for their remarkably innovative and impactful work, which included the transformation of brands like Oreo and Oscar Mayer.

Lee’s current obsessions are rooted in rediscovery and reboots. Rediscovery of old favorite books like Zen and the Martial Arts and A Time of Gifts Reboots like Star Trek’s Strange New Worlds and Discovery.

I’ve known Lee Maicon for over 10 years, tracing back to an intriguing era in New York City (as if NYC is ever lacking intrigue) when advertising professionals grappled with the implications of the digital revolution and emerging social media platforms. Lee was consistently a step ahead, leading the strategy at 360i for companies that pioneered innovative uses of social media to build brands, not just buzz.

Iñaki: Lee, I’ve been obsessed with Patagonia lately and I want to get into it right from the start: I really love their brand story, what makes Patagonia such a unique brand?

Lee: What’s brilliant about Patagonia, is that the product and the story are one. And what’s more, the audience isn’t an audience. They are a part of the story. So when any of us pick up a Patagonia sweater, we get the story baked into the brand and the design. It’s the story of the quest, a hero’s journey.

And there are only a very few story archetypes, so just think that really any product, any brand can find differentiation, just like any story can be different. By learning the form, we learn how to chop it up and mix it up. So many movies or books share the same structure but are differentiated in the details and the craft. Patagonia gets its archetype and the role it plays in the world.

It’s just a question of how the story drives both the product and the brand experience.

I: So is it hard for other brands to be Patagonia?

L: Yes, but it doesn’t have to be hard to take the lessons of Patagonia and help to change a company or a brand. First, of course, there’s a driving purpose. Second, there’s an understanding of where culture intersects with that purpose. And third, there’s a willingness to act quickly in line with that purpose.

OH, and craft and quality matter. The craft of the goods but also the craft of the storytelling. The choice of archetype and how the story of the experience comes to life.

A recent example of this of which I am really proud was our launch work for Don Julio Rosado. We had a really challenging business opportunity (to launch another premium tequila into the world) but it’s been successful not only because the product is great, but also because the entire product world we’ve developed is true to that: spreading fun into the world, during the daytime, not night, modern and Mexican, lighter. It’s one of those products that help reinvent a category through the power of its story

I: One thing I have learned from having worked on both sides, the agency side and the education side, is that every agency has to do the routine-hard-selling work. We tend to glorify the great ads and the great activations, but Facebook sells billions of dollars in ads and nobody talks about them on their website.

L: Yes, I agree; 80% of the work is the nonglamorous stuff, and we all do it. It all pays the bills. Once you learn that most of every agency’s work is stuff that doesn’t appear in big ad trades, it can be liberating.

But to get somewhere interesting with the next 20%, there are at least four things to think about: How do you understand the work in a way that’s different? And how do you see opportunities when they aren’t really there? Third, how do you talk about the work to manifest something special? And lastly, how do you know when to cut bait and not try to create opportunities when they’re not there?

Sometimes you just have to say: Amig@s… this is just a banner ad request that should just be a banner ad. That’s ok… let’s just make a great banner ad.

Balancing creative innovation with practicality is the hallmark of a mature agency.

Of course, our industry has so many examples of small requests that came to life in big ways: our Oreo Vault started as a response to a Tweet. Whopper detour was for an app download.

Both are simple but brilliant ideas, true to the brand. Visually iconic, responding to human behavior.

I: When you look back at all you’ve accomplished, all the different places you’ve been, all the different brands you’ve helped, and all the different people you’ve mentored… Why are you still fighting the good fight? Why are you still interested in doing this?

L: Better work creates better business circumstances for both my clients and my own agency. It’s funny, fight the good fight is one of our sayings in the community. The agency is 23 years old and one of our beliefs is that you have to fight for these opportunities, but you also have to know when not to.

We also fight the good fight because it’s just more rewarding emotionally. We’re in a creative business, motivated by the satisfaction of the right idea.

It feels good when you look at something you’ve worked on and it’s just good. We just want to be closer to better work. And I want to stay focused on that.

Fighting the good fight also creates opportunities for the industry.

I: Do you think we make brand strategy more complicated than it should be?

L: Yes. I think of brand strategy as diplomacy. Is it about consensus, where everybody gets to feel a part of where you wound up? Or is it about solving problems, where everyone is happy with the outcome?

When a brand strategy is about compromise and everybody got their word on the chart with all the things on it, that’s ok. It’s necessary sometimes. But when it’s about clarity, it drives where we need to go.

Those are two very contradictory drivers: compromise versus clarity.
The tension explains where brand strategy gets complex. But it’s on all of us to make choices, and decisions, and solve problems.

I: Have you ever been tempted to go to the client side?

L: When I think about the best experiences I’ve had in my career, it’s when I had my hands pretty close to the steering wheel. So, sure… But there’s also something powerful about being at the agency and being able to have an outsider’s take on the politics inside of our client's businesses.

It can be helpful to think: I know your business, but I don’t really know everything inside your company. And so here’s the best possible thing you should do if I seem to not know all the complications.

I: The number one complaint I’ve heard from clients is that they don’t feel heard by the agency, and they don’t know what to do about it. What can agencies do well that clients can’t in terms of branding strategy?

L: Agencies sometimes act like they need to react versus hear deeply. We need a point of view, and to be clear about what we think needs doing. But it starts with listening.

Once we do, however, we can engender open-mindedness. To not use last year’s plan for this year’s problem.

We can also balance hearing with a little bit of an outsider perspective. Listening is the key to every great relationship. But so is selective hearing. Ruth Bader Ginsburg had a wonderful 50 years of marriage, but when asked about the secret to a great relationship she responded, “You know, sometimes it pays to be a little deaf.”

The same is true in the agency-client relationship. We can hold the mirror up to the brand and find what’s beautiful when they do not see it, or we help them reinvent when they are stuck and may not realize it.

I: You’ve talked about the importance of understanding the consumer. Is that something that an agency can still do better and offer value to a client?

L: The dramatis personae are the key to great stories. And not just the brand actors, but the people we need to empathize with. That outsider’s perspective puts the agency closer, at our best, to the brand’s audiences. The rigor of research can yield art and beauty, and the humanity of who these people are.

Without the audience, there’s no story and no authentic connection.

I: Why do you think we don’t spend time with users as often as we used to?

L: Because we started to be ok with proxies, like social listening. Which was fine until it wasn’t.

In the early days of Facebook, and Twitter, doing these ethnographies at scale could create a map of who the audience was for a particular global brand. And we did it in like, two weeks and it was super cool. It was really smart and interesting. And because you could do it very quickly, clients and agencies got very used to it. But as people became more guarded, the data stopped being as helpful

I: What is a good habit to cultivate to understand what drives people?

L: A willingness to embrace embarrassment.

As a society, we’ve often shied away from situations that might lead to awkwardness. I learned a lesson at an early age that a willingness to immerse yourself in unfamiliar territories can have a profound impact.

When I was a kid, my dad worked for Revlon, mostly in Latin America. Sometimes we would go to a store and while my mom picked out whatever we needed, he would go to the cosmetics section, pick up the sample lipstick or eyeliner, chat with the women who worked there, put product onto his hands, compare colors, picking up displays

I was eight years old. It was mortifying.

But my father was funny and charming and he would learn so much from the experience.
I saw that being willing to put yourself out there, talk to people about stuff and just be embarrassed could be so helpful. When you put yourself in those situations, you learn things. Something happens. Alchemy.

I think a lot of us who have gone through MBA programs were taught to manage processes and not ideas. That the right process will yield the right idea. Process helps. But it needs the emotional truth you get from working through something uncomfortable and not tidy

To switch gears (drastically)), I’m also always inspired by artists like Gerhard Richter, a great artist who manages to create work in ways both process-oriented and deeply emotional. He tries both, he puts himself in a position where he doesn’t really know what’s going to happen, willing to be embarrassed, to feel something. When you go to a place where you could be embarrassed it helps us get to deeper truths.

I: What would you like your legacy to be?

L: Way too early to say, but I have been very fortunate to build a couple of really good teams in a few different places. And the best part of having a good team is that you get to be surprised by the amazing stuff they come up with, not just when we worked together but up until today in their new roles and in different companies.

My mom was a teacher and she was into critical thinking skills. She taught me that you can teach people not just things but how to think.

Witnessing the evolution of ideas I’ve contributed to, as they morph, combine, and inspire further innovation, is profoundly rewarding. This story is a testament to the continuous cycle of learning, sharing, and growth, one that I hope will persist beyond my direct involvement.

Thank you Lee for sharing with us your learnings and experiences during your isnpiring journey.