Let Pop Music Do the Fighting For You
MA’s new single “I Want Ur Luv” is a glittery, dazzling F-bomb raging against Brazil’s homophobia
What is the job of a pop song? Mainstream music’s unabashed pop tropes usually explore, in brief, stories of fleeting youth and love, the temptations of money and fame, and the all-encompassing sugariness of the American dream.
When Nicki Minaj dropped “Anaconda,” a bombastic reclamation of female sexuality in the viral age of twerking, media called it too brash. It was too sexy, and Minaj, one of the world’s biggest female rappers, was deemed tasteless. Given media’s track record of policing brown and black bodies, it seemed only fair that Minaj would face scrutiny for what other contemporary pop stars in her circle could pass off as avant-garde. Between social media, Twitter beefs, public meltdowns, and one iconic VMAs interruption, it appears America’s pop landscape is anything but post-racial.
Good pop is usually audacious. The Madonnas and Elvis Presleys of American culture know how to market spectacle and pop, after all, is about putting on a show. It’s performance. It’s knowing how to make a song about unrequited love or addiction danceable and salable. Pop doesn’t exist outside of race and politics and never has. Naturally, then, being audacious is a privilege.
When I meet with Mariana Troggian, a singer that goes by MA, she speaks almost immediately about her pop influences. She’s from Porto Alegre, the capital of Brazil’s southern state, Rio Grande do Sul. Growing up, Ma says she was immersed in American culture early on in her life. We talk music politics and the pop feminism of Taylor Swift and Katy Perry. “The problem with things like feminism is that we separate ourselves into small groups and we start to judge the pop artists because they are talking about feminism, but they’re kind of acting in a weird way or not being active or helpful to the community about it,” she says.
We both agree that pop music has a sense of urgency other genres fail to capitalize on. Brazil has a longstanding history of homophobia and violence against LGBTQ+ communities. Last year alone, 445 Brazilians were victims of homophobic violence and casualties have reached an all-time high. MA’s newest single, “I Want Ur Luv,” is a sugary pop anthem dedicated to gay love, showcasing her Madonna-esque influences, but its urgent message is one that tackles Brazil’s anti-gay history and the pervasive racialized misogyny against Afro-Brazilian women. It’s an uplifting song but a reminder that love can feel like moving boulders up a hill.
New Stand: I’m really intrigued by the fact that you did a pop song instead of a love ballad or something in that line of thought. Why a high-energy pop anthem and not a ballad?
Mariana Troggian: I feel like it’s just because that’s what I grew up really connected to, and I feel like pop music speaks so much to gay culture and the fact that I would go to parades when I was very young. When I was eight, I was a really big fan of Cher and then I got into Madonna. I feel like I have a lot of pop influence so it never really came to me that I would do differently. And also, I feel like sometimes when you’re talking about something that is so sad…it’s better if [you] can just dance to it.
NS: How does the song change when you present it to Brazilian audiences?
MT: Well I haven’t yet, but I’m really excited. I’ll probably do it in my hometown, which is way more homophobic than São Paulo where I am now, so it’s going to be really interesting. I don’t know because what happens here is there’s so much violence that people, we separate, right? So probably, if I performed the song, I’m going to be in a kind of a safe environment like in a gay club where I have my friend, and of course it’s going to speak a lot to the community, but I don’t know how it would be to perform in a place where I have all kinds of people. I feel like I would just be scared honestly.
NS: How does São Paulo differ from your hometown?
MT: I’m from the south. It’s really the same relationship with America. South is more, you know, conservative. I moved to the states when I was 22. I had a huge language barrier in the beginning that I had to break so I would be able to communicate. Even to write songs, I had to do so much research because the words were just not in me. There were definitely a few things that I — I was even telling my friend right now, for example, I feel like the pressure on women in New York is way less. Brazilian culture is so harsh when it comes to being fit and having your nails done and hair done and makeup. You have to be perfect all the time, and that’s just a relief when you go to New York and you can just be whatever.
NS: When you screened your music during your private performance, I felt like it spoke to that obsession a bit. There’s definitely a type of inclusivity expressed in “I Want Ur Luv” not usually seen in mainstream pop. People of all backgrounds, sizes… We’re usually given a hetero narrative.
MT: Well, I had no money, like I had zero, zero money. I thought, okay, what can I do? I can dress up, you know, in crazy costumes which is kind of cheap and easy to get in New York. It’s also a very queer expression. I love that and I feel like that speaks to me. Because it’s not about me, it’s more about the community, so then I had the idea of having queer people doing the same thing that I was doing, which is express themselves in front of the camera and be free and sing. But it was great because I had a had a great director and we made it work and it looks so nice. It’s simple, but it’s strong.
NS: Why did you release the song in English and not in Portuguese?
MT: I should write in Portuguese, but again, I feel like since a very young age, I was so consumed by American culture. That was my inspiration. I always wrote in English. I write poems sometimes in Portuguese, but music doesn’t really come out of me in Portuguese, which is a shame because we have beautiful music and amazing musicians, but it’s just on my thing.
NS: Can we expect an album soon or are there other projects you want to dedicate time to?
MT: I’m applying for a grant now so I can try to develop a second single and then I’m going to start. I’m starting to work on having an actual band because I’ve been working with a producer all this time in the studio, but [when] performing open mics and acoustic versions, I don’t really have a band that I can create with together. I also have my collective—I’m an actress. And I DJ. A lot of that is about Brazilian culture as well. I’m just excited for a third one. I had the first one, the second that I really love, and not let’s get a third one done.
NS: How did you end up collaborating with Tania from What Would Tilda Swinton Do?
MT: Suzie and I are very good friends. I love what they do and I knew the band, and then I was working with Bob, and when we were shooting the music video, Tania said she wanted to be in it. She identified as queer and she said she wanted to be a part of it. And she was and we were listening to the song really loud, and I feel like the energy in the room was so beautiful during the shoot. And then she looked at me and said, “We have to perform this live.” She was like let’s just do an acoustic version and we did it. And then we started doing open mics, but that came from her. I love the acoustic version.
NS: When you strip it down to the acoustic version, it’s so much more raw and immediate. The single itself is very Lady Gaga-esque. Is she an influence?
MT: Of course! I’m a Gaga fan. I love her. I love her music and just the way she performs. I’m a huge Florence and the Machine fan. Elton John, I’ve been listening to a lot. I grew up with a rock background which is kind of cool. Pink Floyd, I listened to a lot. St. Vincent — I’m listening to the girls. But right now, Florence…I guess she’s been my queen for a while.
NS: Are you solely pop or do you see yourself venturing outside of the genre in the future?
MT: I do definitely. I feel like it’s funny because I always come to the studio with these usually really dark lyrics and melodies. They are kind of dark and then my producer, Bob Brockmann (aka Bassy Bob), he always turns it into something cool and light. I can see myself doing something like dark pop, but I’m not fixated on that. I have a lot of Afro beats in my music as well. I was trying to hang out with musicians and then I met this Brazilian musician and he told me, “You should give this guy a call because I feel like you guys are going to work well together.” I wanted to produce something just to get it out there because I had a bunch of ideas, and then we met. Our first song was called “Black Money.” It’s very experimental and it’s my first single.
NS: You act. You sing. You DJ. Do you ever feel like these mediums support each other or do you find yourself separating your music persona from your acting?
MT: Honestly to me, it’s all the same. Not that it’s the same craft, but the experience of sharing something on stage…that’s kind of a muscle that you just work. But I feel like this really performative style of mine, that comes from acting.
NS: How do you see yourself exploring these mediums in your visuals as you continue with music?
MT: So many artists are kind of creating a film with their album like what Beyonce did with Lemonade. Even for “I Want Ur Luv,” it never actually came to me as a song. It was always a manifesto. From the beginning, I always had the idea that it was gonna be a video with the music, that it would communicate something bigger, right? Short films, experimental stuff — I wanna do it all.
NS: Do you consider your music political?
MT: Political. Feminist. I’m all of that.
NS: Sometimes it’s easy to forget that the liberalism of New York doesn’t necessarily represent the mentality of most Americans and the world. Now that you’re back in Brazil, are there things you miss about the city?
MT: It’s definitely my home. It’s where people really understand what I’m doing and I feel like New York is so rich, and the underground scene is so amazing. You get to perform and to meet the most talented people, you know, performing on the same stage as them.
NS: Has pop music taken on a new meaning for you?
MT: I’ve been listening a lot to Linn da Quebrada, a trans black woman from the Favelas in Brazil. Her lyrics are so political and so great, and when I listen to them, I can’t help but think, that’s great [she’s] doing this.
I feel like there are millions of people right now in the world that identify so much with this, and finally someone like [her] has a voice. You know, finally we got to the point that the people who are oppressed and minorities — we are getting our voices and that’s so great. And it’s not like I have nothing against straight white women who are pop artists. I think they’re all great, but if you think how much pop music is such a big part of gay culture, and it’s always sung by straight women. It’s nice that we’ve started to also take our space and talk about things that are our own experiences.
