Interview with David Naber (Microsoft)
Here’s our next interview with David Naber, Program Manager on Microsoft’s Interact team. As a more recent grad with extensive technical internships and projects, David offers in-depth insights into his own PM journey– and how to find similar success.
What is your current role?
I’m a Program Manager at Microsoft. I’m working on the Interact team, which builds new user experiences and forms of human-computer interaction in Windows. At the moment, I’m working on several projects, some of which include new features for the inking experience of Surface Pen and new features for the Surface Dial.
When did you first become interested in product management?
When I was about halfway through my degree in computer science, I had a scary epiphany: I didn’t want to program for a living. I knew I could become a programmer, but I didn’t think I could become a great one. On a more abstract level, I entered computer science to build cool products and design new user experiences; programming, for me, was simply an ends to a means. In the midst of this mid-college crisis, I stumbled across Jackie Bavaro’s blog, the Art of Product Management, on Quora. I was fascinated by what I read, and intrigued by the prospect of a role that would allow me to leverage design, leadership, and engineering skills all at once to build new products and potentially impact millions of people on a daily basis.
What did you study in school, and how have you found that it relates to your current role?
I studied Computer Science and double-minored in Art + Design and Cinema Studies at the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign. I had an extremely difficult time figuring out what I wanted to major in when I first started school, simply because I loved so many different fields of study. It’s only in retrospect that I can see how my diverse interests have informed my work: the networking and technical skills I gained from my Computer Science degree; the user empathy and eye for visual design that I’ve gained from my Art + Design minor; the communication, writing, and critical thinking skills that I’ve gained from my minor in Cinema Studies.
What are the most important decisions you have made to get you where you are today?
It’s difficult to pinpoint one or two decisions that got me to where I am today; rather than a single decision, what got me where I am today was a combination of shameless networking, hard work and adaptability, perseverance in the face of a multitude of rejections, and a generous helping of luck. One experience that I think many PM candidates tend to undervalue is leadership roles in large organizations, whether they’re charities, student-run organizations, or small businesses. For several years, I lead a student-run musical theater charity at my university, which gave me experience leading others to take a loosely-defined concept (a single-page proposal for a musical) and bring it to fruition (a polished performance that thousands attended). Many of the skills that I gained there were directly transferrable to my current role.
What project of your career are you most proud of?
I’m only a few months into my first full-time position at Microsoft, so I don’t have the most extensive portfolio of professional projects to draw from quite yet. That being said, we’re cooking up some pretty cool stuff over here, and I can’t wait to see where the next few years takes us. One project that I worked on in my college career that was pretty neat is SugarCUB3D, a project that taught kids basic programming concepts and rewarded their work with edible, 3D-printed rewards.
How do you continue to grow as a PM and stay up-to-date on current trends?
Keeping up on the news, especially in the tech world, has allowed me to stay on top of industry trends and remain aware of and empathetic towards my target users. The New York Times, The Washington Post, Tech Crunch, the Verge, and Recode are all staples in my reading list. Additionally, I challenge myself to grab coffee or lunch with a new colleague every week — this allows me to get advice and learn about the experiences of a multitude of people.
Anything else to add?
A few pieces of advice:
- Thicken your skin. Securing one of the most sought-after roles in one of the world’s most bustling industries is no small feat. You’re going to be rejected. Probably a lot. The important thing is that when you do get the dreaded “No” from your dream company, you pick yourself up, brush yourself off, and keep working. If you continue to pursue these roles, you will eventually find something. As I mentioned in a previous Medium post, bombing a few interviews is an essential part of your career search. Nothing really teaches you how to be good wrangling interviews like being put on the spot, interviewing poorly, and then resolving to be better next time.
- Read Cracking the PM Interview. I can’t recommend this book enough. It is the one-stop shop for PM interviews. I read through it once per interview season and practice with it just to keep myself sharp.
- Network shamelessly and relentlessly. You want to work at [Google/Microsoft/Apple/Facebook/wherever]? You know someone who works there. Maybe not directly. Maybe it’s your friend’s friend. Maybe it’s your cousin’s ex-girlfriend’s landlord. Doesn’t matter. Reach out to them, ask them about their role, their company, the project they work on. They will eventually begin to ask question about you, most likely. Ask them to look over your resume and pass it on to a recruiter.
- Use your differences to your advantage. As a member of the LGBTQ community, entering the workforce as a minority was an intimidating thing. I tried to use that to my advantage — in job interviews, when asked to critique products and features, I tried to use that perspective to point out flaws in products that others might not see. (How easy is it to change your name on a profile? What gender pronouns does this website use? Do the privacy settings of this social media website allow for me to engage with my community without “outing” me?) When I was an undergrad, I also attended the Out for Undergrad Tech Conference, a conference specifically for LGBTQ-identifying undergrad students. This allowed me to meet hundreds to LGBTQ-friendly employers and build a large network of other LGBTQ students, many of whom have gone on to do incredible work in the tech industry. Seek out opportunities like these that are designed to reach out to people like you. This goes beyond being a minority — this could extend to work style, social tendencies, and even speaking style. Use each of those traits to your advantage to better connect with others.
Have suggestions for future interviews or want to share your own wisdom? Reach out. We’re on Twitter: @the_pm_project.
