Q&A with Marilyn Hollinger
Embracing disagreements as opportunities, a commitment to avoiding surprises in the workforce, and understanding the need to take control of the conversation around your own career path are just three of the many takeaways from a recent interview with Marilyn Hollinger, Director of UX/UI Engineering at multi-model data platform company, MarkLogic. A common theme while talking with Marilyn is design — not only in the functional sense as it relates to her professional expertise, but in the way she has designed the life and career she wants. In hearing her walk through her background and how she got to the place she is in life right now, I am taking note of her management style and advice for women in tech.
Interview:
Kelsi: Walk me through your education/professional/career history
Marilyn: I attended UCSB on a full scholarship, majoring in Computer Science. I knew I wanted to go into engineering because of my interest in math and science, and the only major that didn’t require chemistry was Computer Science…but this was a long time ago, so I had never used a computer. The summer going into college was my first experience using a computer! After college I moved to the Bay Area, got a job at Xerox, and went to Stanford part time for grad school to get my master’s degree. My advisor at Stanford helped me design a program that was heavy in UX, even though Stanford didn’t have that major at the time. I essentially made my own major.
I became the youngest manager ever at Xerox — at 25 years old. I spent 10 years learning a ton about how corporations work, how to ship software, and how to be a good manager, then I decided to move on. I then spent 12 years at Oracle. Oracle was a significant time for me for a few reasons. First, that’s where I cut my teeth in enterprise software. I was hired at Oracle to do the first GUI tooling for the Oracle database, which I designed, implemented and built a team around. It was also where I made the transition from development to UX design, by pointing out the need for UX to senior management, and becoming the solution to that problem. After stints at Intuit, Genentech, and Guidewire, I knew how to build a good UX team and be a positive addition to the development organization. That’s my plan and vision for my current role at MarkLogic.
Kelsi: What does your role entail now?
Marilyn: I report into Engineering as the Director of UX/UI Engineering. But I was hired with a very broad charter: to improve user experience across the company. I am working on new products, like the Data Hub Service, doing screen designs, and lots of persona work and process mapping. I’m also consulting in other areas of the business, like the corporate website and our documentation. I’m in discussions with Solutions Engineering because they’ve built great tools and software and we’re figuring out how to improve this by applying UX expertise. My job is to improve the experience of using our products, and to implement the strategic processes that make this happen across the organization.
Kelsi: What do you value most about your colleagues and team right now?
Marilyn: The lack of ego. I value that in myself too. If someone says, “I think your design sucks,” I say, “Okay, let’s talk about why.” Disagreement often comes from just needing to get on the same page with shared information. My favorite phrase is “help me understand,” vs. telling somebody they’re wrong. You will get a defensive answer vs. a teaching answer. From a management perspective, that type of response also teaches people how to critically examine themselves.
Kelsi: What have your biggest obstacles been in life?
Marilyn: Being a woman. I am an assertive, opinionated, loud woman, and that is not generally valued. I’ve had to hold myself back in a lot of ways. I don’t think I’ve had a performance review in all of my years that has not mentioned that I’m intimidating. It’s been one of my great strengths but has gotten in the way in high-tech.
Kelsi: Any key people who deeply influenced you and your work?
Marilyn: My first manager at Xerox said to me: “I don’t care if you’re going to cut off my arm, tell me in advance.” It highlighted the importance of being proactive. A manager is going to assume everything is going well; it’s your responsibility to give advanced notice of problems. Avoid surprises if at all possible.
Kelsi: What have you been able to take from that into your own management style?
Marilyn: By the same token, I’m committed to not surprising my team and people with anything, especially around their performance. A formal performance review should have no surprises. If there were issues, we should have been discussing them throughout the year.
Kelsi: What’s your advice for women who are currently working or want to work in tech?
Marilyn: Bring solutions. Make sure you’re heard, don’t count on anybody to give you anything. I see women who expect to be recognized, but that’s not good enough. You have to clearly ask for (demand?) anything you want. If you want a promotion, you have to make it clear that’s your expectation. It’s your manager’s job to help you, but you have to tell them what you expect. And I will echo that it’s important to use a disagreement as an opportunity to learn and/or teach.
Know someone who should be interviewed? Have feedback? Find me on LinkedIn and let’s chat/connect.
