1-on-1 with ABN Amro’s Walter Zantinge: the Corporate Rebel
We believe that innovative professionals are the pioneers of the changing world. That’s why every week we go in-depth with one of our favorites and pick up some lessons about what it takes to be a professional rebel. This week we spoke to Walter Zantinge, Innovation Manager at ABN Amro.
Walter is everything you would not expect someone working in banking to be — informal, rule-breaking and with a deep-seated hatred of suits. He spoke to Roald Tjon about how being unapologetically himself has helped him drive innovation in the Netherlands’ third largest bank.
What do you do at ABN Amro?
Walter started working in the private banking branch of ABN: “This was the best basis for the work I do now. I had to reach targets and focus on execution. I was also never been busy with just my own work. I asked a lot of my clients with accounts ranging anywhere between one to 200 million euros about how they got to where they are.”
Now as Innovation Manager since May 2015 Walter guides projects through 12 week sprints and introduces them to organizational concepts such as Lean and Agile. The focus is on a helping them to experiment and understand the problems they want to address.
Is it difficult to drive change within an organization?
“I’m happy I have ADHD. I run into a wall maybe 300 times a day and I keep going. I also don’t focus on the politics of the situation. I won’t look to my manager before I do something. I’ll try to get it done and then ask what he thinks. A lot of people choose the path of least resistance and they get lost in the trenches of other people’s comfort zone.’
“I have two golden rules — don’t walk in the trenches of someone else’s comfort zone, and on the path of least resistance you get lost the fastest.”
The Lesson: Pick the best path to get to your goals, regardless of the obstacles.
What motivates you?
“I do love helping people and I believe that I get energized from doing so, but only to a certain degree. What really motivates me is winning. I’m really competitive. My clock never stops and because of my ADHD neither does my energy.”
Walter founded and used to run a social entrepreneurship program for children: “I’ve tried a lot of things that I really enjoyed doing, but because of my timeframe I really have to focus now. Over a few years I’ll be a bit further personally and I can mean more to others and help them. Right now I have to help myself.”
The Lesson: Be honest with what really drives you.
As a former board member in ABN’s Diversity Network, do you think it’s important that companies encourage diversity?
“It’s not about whether you’re gay, straight, black, Chinese or whatever you may be, it’s about if you have the space to be yourself. In a big organization an individual is only a number. The focus is on individuals that fit in the larger picture rather than on the anomalies of the individual.’
“The anomalies of individuals should be what keeps an organization running. If every employee had one day a week to work on innovation or social entrepreneurship, basically something for themselves, then there is a lot more space to be different.”
Would you consider yourself a professional rebel?
“In my own blog I described myself as a corporate rebel, which is different from someone working in a small company. Corporate culture can really kill people’s spirit. When I look around I see a lot of worn out people.’
“You need to be yourself and you need to be very aware of what you are and aren’t capable of. If you aren’t, then you make more mistakes. If you are, then people know what to expect, they see quality and you can relate more to managers because you’re comfortable with who you are.”
Is there something you do to try to feel more like yourself?
“I don’t wear a suit anymore. Only if I have to and even then I’ll wear a sweater and a jacket with my cap. With my last few experiments I told participants that I want them to take off the suit and show up in a t-shirt and jeans. I said, ‘I want you to be the person you are at home.’ It took them three weeks before they were comfortable doing that.’
“About 40 per cent of my job is organizational change and 60 per cent is operational excellence for innovation. It’s important for people to feel like themselves because then they’re more open to new ideas and can really learn. In the same way, a dog can never feel free to play if he’s stuck on a leash.”
What keeps you up at night?
“My ideas and my dreams, which are stuck in my head. Right now I’m trying to work out a business idea with some partners and we’re also going to set up a roast for startups because we see a lot of things that they could do better.’
“The number one thing startups need to work on is their ability to reflect on what they do and don’t do well, and to act on that. In our department at ABN we always say innovating is like eating glass, it sucks, and being an entrepreneur is even harder work. The ones that do it well focus on the nitty gritty to excel.”
The Lesson: Becoming better means doing the things that suck.
Which people have influenced you most?
“My mom and dad and a few of my clients. My mom is 65 and retired and she’s just started studying again to be able do something else. I’ve had clients that are 70 and have started a new company. They’re not trying to follow the cadence of the world, but are following their own cadence, energy and intuition.’
“That’s the great thing: whether you’re 20 or 70, you can be doing the same thing. The tempo might be different, but you always have the opportunity to find yourself again.”
Is there something people would be surprised to know about you?
“People really wouldn’t expect that sometimes I really enjoy total rest. I’m usually in my own manic world and people don’t always understand me. At times I don’t understand myself, so it can be good to relax. I like to listen to classical music then, like Ludovico Einaudi and Rachmaninoff. I also like to take walks, especially on Sundays through Amsterdam Oost. I can then disappear and drown in my own ideas.”
Any tips to other rebels out there?
“Try to surround yourself with other professional rebels because then your ideas have a higher chance of succeeding. If you can bring rebels together then new ideas come into life that can have a big impact, in or outside of a company.”
Professional Rebel & Walter: Plenty of people say they’re straight shooters, but Walter is someone who really doesn’t get lost in ‘the politics’. Speaking with him is a direct and refreshingly honest affair. We got in touch with him through Jan-Jaap Verhoeven, aka the “king connector”, whom he sometimes works with at TSO. Walter will also be taking part in our Intrapreneurship round table on 21 March.
Get in touch with Walter: Twitter | Medium | Instagram
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